TJ parked next to JL

Chris said:
Very true. Fiat Chrysler knows that in order to stay relevant though, they had to make the Wrangler appeal to a much broader audience. If they were still selling TJs to this day and they remained entirely unchanged, they wouldn't sell enough of them to make big profits. The introduction of the 4 door and all the creature comforts was a smashing success for them, because it gave the Wrangler the appeal of an SUV, which ultimately helped to propel them to massive sales (take notice of how many 4 door Wranglers you see versus 2 doors).

But along with that comes bigger Wranglers, more electronics, higher prices, etc.

It's a damn shame, but from a business / profit standpoint, I get why they did what they did. The audience who wants a cool looking SUV is far larger than the guys like you and I who want a small, nimble, simple off-road vehicle.
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I don't necessarily agree with that. They started producing the 4 doors because of the federal mandated weight to emissions standards. They get much more leeway with the bigger trucks. They are only allowed to sell so many vehicles that are small, so they create bigger ones that have less standards. Then they market the shit out of them. When I was selling my JK(puke) I was looking for a 2 door short bed 4 wheel drive truck. I went to two Ram dealers, and both told me that they do not sell them because there is no demand for them. But I finally found one and traded my JK (sorry future buyer) in on it. Who that doesn't have a family wouldn't want a shortbed 4x4 pickup with a mild level lift on it? They were telling me that they are only allowed to sell a certain amount of small trucks, but big trucks have less requirements. They have more laws and standards for smaller vehicles than larger ones. (Do you smell a lobbyist here?)

So they buy a shit-ton of these 4 doors, and market them with rebates and incentives. In all seriousness how many 4 doors have you seen at your old wheeling hole? Not many I am betting. They are not good as a two door TJ,YJ,CJ. out in the woods or rocks. They would make good beach crawlers with the right gears and tires. but I am willing to bet you don't see many people running them off-road. Most of us don't want those big gutless POS' I am guessing. We are just slapped in the face with marketing when we go buy them. I wouldn't buy another new one.

All of that said I probably wouldn't mind a JK if it came with a V8, especially like a 350 hemi like in the Ram. Whatever the reason these keep getting bigger and bigger, I am less and less interested in them. For now I will just continue to love my TJ and hang out here with you good tj folk for as long as you guys will keep your TJ's. I most likely won't see you on the JL forums. hehe. I may be the only one left on this forum, but I am going to stick it out here with @Chris as long as I can. (unless he gets tired of me disagreeing with him.)
 
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ac_ said:
I don't necessarily agree with that. They started producing the 4 doors because of the federal mandated weight to emissions standards. They get much more leeway with the bigger trucks. They are only allowed to sell so many vehicles that are small, so they create bigger ones that have less standards. Then they market the shit out of them. When I was selling my JK(puke) I was looking for a 2 door short bed 4 wheel drive truck. I went to two Ram dealers, and both told me that they do not sell them because there is no demand for them. But I finally found one and traded my JK (sorry future buyer) in on it. Who that doesn't have a family wouldn't want a shortbed 4x4 pickup with a mild level lift on it? They were telling me that they are only allowed to sell a certain amount of small trucks, but big trucks have less requirements. They have more laws and standards for smaller vehicles than larger ones. (Do you smell a lobbyist here?)

So they buy a shit-ton of these 4 doors, and market them with rebates and incentives. In all seriousness how many 4 doors have you seen at your old wheeling hole? Not many I am betting. They are not good as a two door TJ,YJ,CJ. out in the woods or rocks. They would make good beach crawlers with the right gears and tires. but I am willing to bet you don't see many people running them off-road. Most of us don't want those big gutless POS' I am guessing. We are just slapped in the face with marketing when we go buy them. I wouldn't buy another new one.

All of that said I probably wouldn't mind a JK if it came with a V8, especially like a 350 hemi like in the Ram. Whatever the reason these keep getting bigger and bigger, I am less and less interested in them. For now I will just continue to love my TJ and hang out here with you good tj folk for as long as you guys will keep your TJ's. I most likely won't see you on the JL forums. hehe. I may be the only one left on this forum, but I am going to stick it out here with @Chris as long as I can. (unless he gets tired of me disagreeing with him.)
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Make no mistake though, with 4 doors, the amount of people the Wrangler appeals to is tremendously larger than when they only offered it in 2 doors. It was a damn smart move on Chrysler’s part.
 
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Chris said:
...In all fairness though, I didn't like the JK look at all when it first came out. It took about 10 years to grow on me to the point where I don't mind them now. However, when I compared the JK (or JL) to the TJ, it's still no contest in terms of who wins in the looks department.
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I hear ya. My wife loved her jk but now that the tj is in the driveway she has said she likes the way it looks better. She says “it just looks more like a Jeep”. :)
 
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Chris said:
Make no mistake though, with 4 doors, the amount of people the Wrangler appeals to is tremendously larger than when they only offered it in 2 doors. It was a damn smart move on Chrysler’s part.
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As a business move I can respect it. Any other way no way.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
 
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I love the size of the TJ. I wouldn't have a Jeep any other way, this even includes the LJ. And no, I'm not anti large vehicle, my dd is a 3500 Ram.
 
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Anyone remember when the 1997 Wrangler was finally revealed, and was the coolest looking thing ever? Far cry from the JL...I sat at the dealership and was riveted to the sales literature...

U9JEGEB1.jpg

2016-05-16-14.45.53-900x439_23485.jpg
 
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my thoughts only I don't want to bust anyones bubble it like comparing early corvettes/ 2 setter t birds to a hummer to big and to wide when the hummers first came to town they took em on the rubicon and tore em up not empressed at all to me the new style is plum butt ugly one mans thoughts
 
IMHO, the TJ is the last Wrangler that looks like it could actually hit a little trail and fit through some trees on a path. The new ones are way too big for real trail use unless of course the trail is huge. This of course is just my opinion. I really like smaller for trail use. When I had a modified XJ with 5.5" lift and Dana 44 rear I felt it could go almost anywhere and could take down most, BUT not a TJ or really any, prior Wrangler/CJ etc. Little Jeeps are just light and the best for the trail. I feel Jeep has lost its way IMHO. I don't have super strong feelings about it, just how I feel.
 
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ac_ said:
I don't necessarily agree with that. They started producing the 4 doors because of the federal mandated weight to emissions standards. They get much more leeway with the bigger trucks. They are only allowed to sell so many vehicles that are small, so they create bigger ones that have less standards. Then they market the shit out of them. When I was selling my JK(puke) I was looking for a 2 door short bed 4 wheel drive truck. I went to two Ram dealers, and both told me that they do not sell them because there is no demand for them. But I finally found one and traded my JK (sorry future buyer) in on it. Who that doesn't have a family wouldn't want a shortbed 4x4 pickup with a mild level lift on it? They were telling me that they are only allowed to sell a certain amount of small trucks, but big trucks have less requirements. They have more laws and standards for smaller vehicles than larger ones. (Do you smell a lobbyist here?)

So they buy a shit-ton of these 4 doors, and market them with rebates and incentives. In all seriousness how many 4 doors have you seen at your old wheeling hole? Not many I am betting. They are not good as a two door TJ,YJ,CJ. out in the woods or rocks. They would make good beach crawlers with the right gears and tires. but I am willing to bet you don't see many people running them off-road. Most of us don't want those big gutless POS' I am guessing. We are just slapped in the face with marketing when we go buy them. I wouldn't buy another new one.

All of that said I probably wouldn't mind a JK if it came with a V8, especially like a 350 hemi like in the Ram. Whatever the reason these keep getting bigger and bigger, I am less and less interested in them. For now I will just continue to love my TJ and hang out here with you good tj folk for as long as you guys will keep your TJ's. I most likely won't see you on the JL forums. hehe. I may be the only one left on this forum, but I am going to stick it out here with @Chris as long as I can. (unless he gets tired of me disagreeing with him.)
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ac_ here you go...this should suffice....I would drive this

Jeep 6x6.jpg
 
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glwood said:
Now that's impressive. I'm guessing you still have the Sahara?
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Yes its my DD. Keep in mind I am not the original owner. I am the second owner. The guy that bought this original in 97 has ALL the original paperwork. He parked it for ALONG time and then it was traded in by his family so my wife found it and we bought it still original and with 75k original miles.
 
Oh yes that's an M939 Series 5 ton. Cummins diesel and an Allison transmission. I call them Road pigs for they are SUPER slow on acceleration. That one has the bed bobbed and its not a Mercedes by any way shape or form. Oh and they ride worse than a CJ
 
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