Wildman's TJ is getting a face lift

[Wildman]

This intake is HEAVY and awkward to try and set in place so I am going to disassemble it as outlined in the instructions for additional porting.

Additional porting:
If you are going to perform additional modifications to the manifold, please
follow the disassembly instructions below:
Remove fuel rails by removing the 10-32 screws holding the rails to the
mounts and the two short screws holding the throttle and TV cable mounts
to the fuel rail mount.
Remove outer throttle bodies as a pair by removing the 4 bolts per throttle
body and lifting them off the intake together.
Remove central throttle body
Do not remove the fuel rail mounts from the top adaptor plate, they have
spacers that are matched to the injector height.
You can leave the adaptor plate in place for porting, but do not use a
caustic agent to clean the top plate or the anodized finish will be
damaged. To remove the top plate, loosen the 12 flat head 5/16 screws.
To re-assemble the intake system reverse the operation. Do not use a
sealant on the top plate or throttle body gaskets. Torque top plate blts to 6
ft lbs. Throttle body bolts should be tightened until snug, approx 8ft lbs.

This hopefully will allow me to mess around with it more and try to get it in place this third time around and not have any more leaks. Plus after talking to F&B again they suggested that I set the intake onto the engine without the gaskets and make sure everything is flat. NOT sure what to do if it isn't at this point but I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.

 

[Wildman]

What kind of gaasket sealer were you using that was red? Is there a reason you didn't use something like the Ultra black or "Right Stuff" instead?

This is the gasket sealant that was red.

And I used Right Stuff on both ends of the valley.

 

[Gollywomper]

This is the gasket sealant that was red.

View attachment 390042And I used Right Stuff on both ends of the valley.

If I need a gasket maker it is almost always Right Stuff these days.

 

[reddvltj]

This is the gasket sealant that was red.

View attachment 390042And I used Right Stuff on both ends of the valley.

Thought I recognized it. I've never had good luck with High Tack, I either put them on dry (not the eaiest thing to do if there are no guides to hang them on) or I use Permatex Ultra Black (same as right stuff for the most part).
I can't imagine you're leak being very big since it's gone from one side to the other. Maybe the added thickness of a little Right Stuff would seal that gap? not to mention it stays pliable where the High Tack doesn't. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[Wildman]

If I need a gasket maker it is almost always Right Stuff these days.

It's a new stuff for me and I've only used it a few times but I do like it in the aerosol can. It comes out nice and easy. Fingers crossed this is the LAST time I take this apart.

 

[Gollywomper]

It's a new stuff for me and I've only used it a few times but I do like it in the aerosol can. It comes out nice and easy. Fingers crossed this is the LAST time I take this apart.

It is one of the few that are ready to rock instantly, no cure time needed.

 

[Wildman]

Thought I recognized it. I've never had good luck with High Tack, I either put them on dry (not the eaiest thing to do if there are no guides to hang them on) or I use Permatex Ultra Black (same as right stuff for the most part).
I can't imagine you're leak being very big since it's gone from one side to the other. Maybe the added thickness of a little Right Stuff would seal that gap? not to mention it stays pliable where the High Tack doesn't. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Are you suggesting that I put ultra black around the intake ports? I thought this is what the High Tack was supposed to do to help with sealing?

 

[reddvltj]

Are you suggesting that I put ultra black around the intake ports? I thought this is what the High Tack was supposed to do to help with sealing?

View attachment 390045

Not a full on bead of it, no. Just a thin layer swiped on with a finger all the way around all the ports and water jackets on both sides of the gasket.

Right Stuff and Permatex Ultra brand sealants are great at filling gaps, far better than High Tack.

 

[Wildman]

Not a full on bead of it, no. Just a thin layer swiped on with a finger all the way around all the ports and water jackets on both sides of the gasket.

Right Stuff and Permatex Ultra brand sealants are great at filling gaps, far better than High Tack.

My guess is that I don't have any leakage on the head sides of the gaskets but it's the manifold to gasket side that is causing the issues. I need to find the assembly video I'd seen where they were doing a 5.9 and used something like Right Stuff around the water ports but I don't remember if they did the intake ports also or not.

Yep, here it is at 13:40 in the video

 

[reddvltj]

I just had a thought spring up from the depths of my grey matter.

When you had the engine machine work done for the stroker, did they deck the heads or block?

 

[Wildman]

I just had a thought spring up from the depths of my grey matter.

When you had the engine machine work done for the stroker, did they deck the heads or block?

As far as I know they did not but I've got to find my paperwork from the machine shop and double check everything.

As you said earlier it seems like the intake gets cocked slightly to one side or the other each time I've installed it. So I agree that there isn't a LOT of difference between the intake manifold and the block. So I've got the new gaskets ordered from NAPA & according to the computer they were in stock so I'll go pick them up in the morning and tear the engine back down. When I put the intake on this time I'll put a small bead around each intake & water port and then reassemble it. Hopefully taking the TB's off will help with the weight some and I can wiggle it a little as I put it in place.

I think I'm also going to cut the heads off 8 of the old intake bolts and use them as guides when I set the intake back on the engine.

 

[Wildman]

I'm just FUCKING PISSED that I have to tear this thing apart all over again because believe me when I say it is a major PITA to do.

 

[FarFire70]

This intake is HEAVY and awkward to try and set in place...

Don't recall reading how you're putting the intake back into place but have you considered or are you using an engine hoist and leveler? Probably stating the obvious but sometimes it bears stating in case it was overlooked.

Enjoy watching the thread and your build! Eager to see you and that Jeep back on the trail

 

[Wildman]

Don't recall reading how you're putting the intake back into place but have you considered or are you using an engine hoist and leveler? Probably stating the obvious but sometimes it bears stating in case it was overlooked.

Enjoy watching the thread and your build! Eager to see you and that Jeep back on the trail

This isn't a bad idea but it isn't that heavy it's more awkward to try to set into place. I think using the old bolts as guides to make it set onto the block even is going to be the key to getting it on correctly.

Here's to finger crossed that this works and that I can get it on RIGHT this next time as I'm tired of farting with it. Of course the other option is to go back to the Hughes Air Gap intake and sell the 6Pack.

 

[Wildman]

Edelbrock makes a gasket set for my engine that appears to have better sealing around the ports.

The Fel Pro gaskets are just a flat gasket. I'm tempted to order a set and see if these would help any.

OK I take this back. After a little more looking it does appear that Fel Pro offers a similar gasket set. And this is what I've got on order at NAPA for tomorrow.

Everyone CROSS your fingers.

 

[Paparock1]

I would definitely check the manifold head fitment and see where the high spots are if any. At this point following the standard TQ procedure doesn't seem to be working. You might look for the high spots and work each bolt down in smaller TQ increments starting with the high spots first. and come up with your own pattern. I would do this a few times without a gasket and not going to full TQ but more of just a couple of dry runs. I am not sure how well you can see the matting surfaces thought but just adding my 2 cents.

Good luck and keep calm as I know what happens to anyone when frustrations build.

 

[Wildman]

I would definitely check the manifold head fitment and see where the high spots are if any. At this point following the standard TQ procedure doesn't seem to be working. You might look for the high spots and work each bolt down in smaller TQ increments starting with the high spots first. and come up with your own pattern. I would do this a few times without a gasket and not going to full TQ but more of just a couple of dry runs. I am not sure how well you can see the matting surfaces thought but just adding my 2 cents.

Good luck and keep calm as I know what happens to anyone when frustrations build.

I don't know how much I'll be able to see either but yes I'm going to try installing it dry first to see if I can identify any issues. Honestly I've never had a intake manifold give me so much trouble installing it and I've done 100 or more in my life. This has to be the most problematic one I've ever seen.

I'm taking today off so I can calm down and not get in a hurry. Plus my son is coming to visit for a day or two while out here from FL so it's a nice distraction.

 

[Wildman]

Something else I'd noticed this time while it was running is that my serpentine belt was jumping and I still have a chirp now & then. I'd replaced the tensioner in 2008 or 09 I think so I ordered a new belt & tensioner & idler pulley to see if I can't finally get rid of that chirp.

But all this stuff won't be here until the end of next week which gives me time to mess with the intake some before I button it all back up and reassemble everything. I've got tons of other thing I can be doing too while I wait for parts.

 

[Wildman]

OK here is the old intake manifold gaskets

And then here is the new gasket set. With it being that little bit thicker.

 

[Mike_H]

I would put that intake on without gaskets and use some grease on the heads or intake. Drop it on there, put a little push on it from the bolts (no need to go full torque) and see where you're making contact. I'd expect one or another of the mounting surfaces is just a bit off and the intake is rocking back and forth. Maybe the thicker gaskets will get your there...but if you have a bad machine job, the time to find it is now.