Is it worth trading for this TJ?

[Dwwhite]

Folks,
I’m a newly registered member and POTENTIAL new TJ owner ( I’m an FSJ guy at heart).
Long story short, I’ve been offered a 2003 Rubicon in trade for a car I have for sale.

Initially it looked like a good trade, but the photos raised a few red flags for me and I’m hoping that the TJ savants here on the forum can help me determine if it’s a real Rubicon or if the only upgrades are some decals.

My primary concerns…
1.) Rubicon Sport?
2.) Rubicon decal placement on the hood seems off
3.) Rear axle appears to MAYBE have drum brakes… I thought all Rubicons had discs at all 4 corners.

Any help is appreciated, I’m just trying to avoid getting burned here…
Thanks in advance.

 

[Oberst Oswald]

I'm pretty sure it is a fake.

 

[LONGJP2]

I’m a newly registered member and POTENTIAL new TJ owner ( I’m an FSJ guy at heart).
Long story short, I’ve been offered a 2003 Rubicon in trade for a car I have for sale.

Initially it looked like a good trade, but the photos raised a few red flags for me and I’m hoping that the TJ savants here on the forum can help me determine if it’s a real Rubicon or if the only upgrades are some decals.

My primary concerns…
1.) Rubicon Sport?
2.) Rubicon decal placement on the hood seems off
3.) Rear axle appears to MAYBE have drum brakes… I thought all Rubicons had discs at all 4 corners.

Any help is appreciated, I’m just trying to avoid getting burned here…
Thanks in advance.

Yes, it should have rear discs.
You can check the VIN.
Looks to be missing the Rubicon rocker guards (and holes).
Hard to tell, but the flares don't look to be wide enough.
No Rubicon wheels.
Does is have the factory lockers and switches?

 

[Dwwhite]

Wow, you guys are great, and quick.

I’m going to ask for a vin, I understand I’m looking for a 6 in the 6th spot?
Unfortunately, while the jeep is pretty close by West Texas standards, he’s still nearly 4 hours away, so I haven’t seen the rig in person, and thus far, I only have exterior pics, so no answers as to factory lockers (or switches) or other interior details.

I’m trying to avoid going even halfway if this is a fools errand from the get go.

Thanks again for the help.

 

[JMT]

Wow, you guys are great, and quick.

I’m going to ask for a vin, I understand I’m looking for a 6 in the 6th spot?
Unfortunately, while the jeep is pretty close by West Texas standards, he’s still nearly 4 hours away, so I haven’t seen the rig in person, and thus far, I only have exterior pics, so no answers as to factory lockers (or switches) or other interior details.

I’m trying to avoid going even halfway if this is a fools errand from the get go.

Thanks again for the help.

Yes, a Rubicon has a 6 in the 6th spot of the VIN.

The rest are tells. The Jeep says Sport on the tub and no signs of diamond plate rocker guard panel having ever been under the door, so looks like a Rubicon Wannabe.

 

[DaveC]

VIN will confirm one way or the other but just visually, it looks off.

Sticker wrong size
Fender flares are too narrow
Rubicon wouldn't have the fender flare extensions
Rubicon should have rocker guards, and if removed, the nutserts should be visible

 

[WestCoastDan]

That MIGHT be a Rubicon hood.

 

[MountaineerTom]

It still looks like it could be a good Jeep, just not a Rubicon. If you still would be interested in it let them know of the the details that says it’s NOT a Rubicon (the VIN most importantly) and you might be able to get it with some cash from the person wanting to trade.

 

[PickleLJ]

Do both of the Differential covers on front and rear axle look like this? if so that's one more way to help identify if its got the right parts underneath

 

[TheBoogieman]

Nope. Even the Rubicon decal is in the wrong place.

 

[Dwwhite]

All,
Thanks for the help and advice. I think we're going to back away from this one for now.
@MountaineerTom - agreed that it still looks pretty good, but the owner claims to have bought the Jeep new from a dealer, and claims it's a Rubicon...
Thanks to you all, I now know at least one of those things isn't true...
I suspect that there are probably other things he's being dishonest about and I don't want to find out the hard way.

Thanks again to the forum and all those who replied. Looks like you all kept me out of a potentially bad deal.

DWW

 

[MountaineerTom]

All,
Thanks for the help and advice. I think we're going to back away from this one for now.
@MountaineerTom - agreed that it still looks pretty good, but the owner claims to have bought the Jeep new from a dealer, and claims it's a Rubicon...
Thanks to you all, I now know at least one of those things isn't true...
I suspect that there are probably other things he's being dishonest about and I don't want to find out the hard way.

Thanks again to the forum and all those who replied. Looks like you all kept me out of a potentially bad deal.

DWW

Good call considering all that.

 

[TheBoogieman]

I'd run the VIN# and check it out for shits and giggles. My neighbor put Rubicon axles, lockers, and the 241 tcase in his Sahara before he sold it for $10,000. It was a SAHARACON.

 

[AndyG]

The hood stickers on a factory Rubicon average 5 inches from the latch.

Like @JMT said above the six digit is the number six of the vin- that is the mark of the beast

There is no Rubicon model made with drum brakes

There will be a locker switch on the dash under the climate controls

There’s a lot more but you’re smart enough to know somebody is trying to pass something off that is not what it presents itself to be.

I wonder what’s going to happen one day when somebody gets one of those things out on the trail and they are halfway up something treacherous and somebody says “hey Earl engage the lockers“ And he says what lockers....

 

[B1Toad]

Crazy what some people do. I'm into 99-03 Superduty diesels, a buddy got one with the Platinum trim package, or so he thought. Someone had just re-painted an XLT and slapped the Platinum decals on it.

 

[AndyG]

Crazy what some people do. I'm into 99-03 Superduty diesels, a buddy got one with the Platinum trim package, or so he thought. Someone had just re-painted an XLT and slapped the Platinum decals on it.

Lord

I had one of the last 03 diesel E350s sold through a dealership in the United States-

Man it was a great work van .

 

[Barely Krawlified]

I see that you are (wisely in my opinion) backing away from this TJ.

Moving forward, for Jeeps built in 1998 or afterwards, you can obtain the build sheet for a specific Jeep by entering its VIN into the search box here:

https://fcagroup.my.site.com/RAM/s/equipment-listing

Armed with the VIN you’ll be able to determine EXACTLY what it left the factory with. Further, the build sheet also identifies the trim (Rubicon, Sahara, Sport, X, etc…).

Kinda wish you had obtained the build sheet for this particular TJ and brought a printed copy to show the seller. The idiotic look on his face when you showed him that his Jeep ain’t no Rubicon (and thus, that he’s also clearly lying by claiming to have bought it new off the lot) would be absolutely priceless.

 

[Obi-Wan]

 

[JEEPCJTJ]

... but the owner claims to have bought the Jeep new from a dealer, and claims it's a Rubicon...

At this point I'd still do my best to get a close look to see if that sport is l worth the trade. Of course if it isn't worth it I'd do my best to drag the trade out so long that he'd reconsider lying again.

 

[Dwwhite]

One final update -

I've reached out to the potential seller/tradee for a VIN number two or three times over the last couple of days - radio silence...
Big surprise, right?
I think at this point, it's safe to assume misrepresentation at best, and outright fraud at worst. I don't have any doubt that the jeep exists, and that he would have happily traded me, but it's definitely not as represented.

Thanks again for all the advice and guidance,
I'd like to reiterate that this has been probably the most pleasant forum experience I've ever had. Everybody has been super polite and helpful...
I didn't even get a single "Search the past threads!!!"

I may have to go find a TJ to buy just so I can join up officially...