Long arm advantage question

Arthurius said:
Since you have a jeep lifted higher than usual and want information about making it a better ride, you will find a lot of conflicting opinions. I would suggest reaching out directly to folks in your terrain area and asking them for information about kit that works. Many on here will try and steer you in one direction and that is usually that long arms have no purpose.

Just for shits and giggles, here's a photo of long arms being used effectively in a manner that most folks on this forum would scoff at. Jeepspeed!

I've had a discussion with some on here before that said that length of arms aren't a factor in the photo below and that this same build can be achieved with shorter arms and correct shock valving. To that, i say good luck.

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But there's not much left of the actual Jeep there. Look into the rear well, and it's basically almost trophy truck... There is zero inside cab left behind the front seats, and I'd almost venture to say there's nothing really "Jeep" from the cowl back on the body... even the door areas are not close to factory.
 
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mrblaine said:
I beg to differ, and very enthusiastically at that.
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Admittedly, I don't build these trucks but as a fan going to the finish lines I see long arm kits frequently.
Artsifrtsi said:
But there's not much left of the actual Jeep there
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Its just a TJ tub and frame that was clearanced to fit huge travel lengths. Isn't that what we all want? lol
 
jjvw said:
You are doing a whole lot of projecting. Blackjack's responses are entirely consistent with mine. The significant difference is that Blackjack entered into this after angry Alaska guy's incoherent series of questions got sorted out.

Angry Alaska guy is upset because he is incapable of recognizing the confusion he created, which required that he be corraled so that something useful could come of this. He got that. The most offensive aspect of this is him using his health as justification for his vitriolic obstinance to actually learning something about a topic he wants to know more about.
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You are kinda special
Arthurius said:
Since you have a jeep lifted higher than usual and want information about making it a better ride, you will find a lot of conflicting opinions. I would suggest reaching out directly to folks in your terrain area and asking them for information about kit that works. Many on here will try and steer you in one direction and that is usually that long arms have no purpose.

Just for shits and giggles, here's a photo of long arms being used effectively in a manner that most folks on this forum would scoff at. Jeepspeed!

I've had a discussion with some on here before that said that length of arms aren't a factor in the photo below and that this same build can be achieved with shorter arms and correct shock valving. To that, i say good luck.

View attachment 495357
Click to expand...

Thanks man. Up home most all rigs for tundra are huge beasts and little to no jeeps so I'm trying to build a multi use one for tundra but able to traverse the woods and tight trails as well. I also have a beast of a suburban perfect for tundra but worthless for the woods so this lets call it hybrid experiment is deffinitly a challenge. Im deffinitly taking in ALL of the input and sorting it out. And again, thank you ✊
 
Most of the 'tundra' trucks I saw when we were up there on the Kenai Pen. this past summer were Tacomas or full size trucks... and they all had racks to haul their dip-nets. The only Jeeps I saw were either stock, or typical JK builds, where they were lifted just enough to clear a larger tire with no flex.
 
I would like to see more pictures of your rig, @ALASKANMADMAN . You just thanked a guy for showing you picture of an ultra4 race car…and I’m pretty certain that is NOT what you want.

Race cars are specifically build, single purpose machine. Kinda the antithesis of “multi-purpose.
 
Arthurius said:
Admittedly, I don't build these trucks but as a fan going to the finish lines I see long arm kits frequently.
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That car won many times and it did it without a long arm kit. It beat other cars in higher classes while doing so. Stock frame, stock body with no modifications to the exterior sheetmetal to move it away from looking like a stock rig other than race specific safety requirements.
Arthurius said:
Its just a TJ tub and frame that was clearanced to fit huge travel lengths. Isn't that what we all want? lol
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Only if you don't know any better.
 
Mike_H said:
I would like to see more pictures of your rig, @ALASKANMADMAN . You just thanked a guy for showing you picture of an ultra4 race car…and I’m pretty certain that is NOT what you want.

Race cars are specifically build, single purpose machine. Kinda the antithesis of “multi-purpose.
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He called Josh a credit card builder so we need to find out if he is doing the work himself or paying someone to do it.
 
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jjvw said:
My preference would be to assume someone wants to learn and that a challenge to their preconceived ideas would lead to further questions.

Your suggestion is to treat angry Alaska guy like an delicate, reactionary, volatile child from the very start. I'm not interested in dancing around that.
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Will you be nicer to me if I PM you my medical records and issues (or tell you I'm a Dem)? No way in Hell you're getting the psychological ones. ;)
 
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Mike_H said:
You just thanked a guy for showing you picture of an ultra4 race car
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The ATK car is a registered Jeepspeed car. Jeepspeed and Ultra4 are two totally different disciplines.

I also pointed out that the photo was an anecdote showing that there is an application where long arms are effective, contrary to the forums belief. That car might struggle to rock crawl but it looks to be damned good at running whoops at speed.

A long arm kit may be the most cost-effective option for OP to stabilize a jeep lifted 7 fucking inches. He should just acknowledge that type of build will have certain drawbacks and compromises.

Personally I would lower it and put it on wider axles. Would eliminate alot of this bickering.
 
Arthurius said:
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A long arm kit may be the most cost-effective option for OP to stabilize a jeep lifted 7 fucking inches. He should just acknowledge that type of build will have certain drawbacks and compromises.
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Where does the stability come from? That's kinda the point of this entire mess.
 
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jjvw said:
Where does the stability come from?
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The stabilizers!:geek:

That's why I think we shouldn't derail the thread into long vs short arm. We should tell OP the short arms he has currently are likely fine, long arms aren't the solution, and the instability issue he feels on the road should be remedied elsewhere. I would adjust wither lift height or track width? He says his shocks are good.

If I was going through the muskeg I would want the most lift I could stuff into the available wheelbase with the widest axles, so I see where he's coming from.
 
Arthurius said:
The ATK car is a registered Jeepspeed car. Jeepspeed and Ultra4 are two totally different disciplines.

I also pointed out that the photo was an anecdote showing that there is an application where long arms are effective, contrary to the forums belief. That car might struggle to rock crawl but it looks to be damned good at running whoops at speed.

A long arm kit may be the most cost-effective option for OP to stabilize a jeep lifted 7 fucking inches. He should just acknowledge that type of build will have certain drawbacks and compromises.

Personally I would lower it and put it on wider axles. Would eliminate alot of this bickering.
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Regardless of discipline, it is a race car, No? That is the point, not what class or type of racing its doing. I wasn't pointing out anything about your post, other that the OP seems to think that it supports his desire to buy a "long arm" kit. Not to mention, it was directed at him, not you (cuz I tagged him, not you).

Arm length is a result of suspension geometery, not a goal, in and of itself.

If the OP can describe what he DOESN'T like about the current set-up (in more specific terms that "more stability), we may be able to help him with Geometry and new link design to counter some of the negative aspects of the rig. Comparing a "long arm" to a "short arm" lift as originally requested is silly, if you think about arm length as a result and not a goal.
 
ALASKANMADMAN said:
Ok there has been no answer to long vs short arms. Ive got great shocks so maybe its something in the communication so WHAT shock advise so YOU have?
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I’ve had both long and short arm set ups- arms are no more stable than the connection, period. I only run short arms now.

The “lesser arc” theory is laughable, as axle up and down travel at road speed is minimal.

The shocks, sway bars, links, and all connections, including the control arms and track bars (track bars are control arms) and sidewall tire flex, are the rigs primary players of stability. Springs not so much.
 
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Arthurius said:
The stabilizers!:geek:

That's why I think we shouldn't derail the thread into long vs short arm. We should tell OP the short arms he has currently are likely fine, long arms aren't the solution, and the instability issue he feels on the road should be remedied elsewhere. I would adjust wither lift height or track width? He says his shocks are good.

If I was going through the muskeg I would want the most lift I could stuff into the available wheelbase with the widest axles, so I see where he's coming from.
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I tried. I tried really hard to do that. 🤣
 
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