Coolant System Advice

[freedom_in_4low]

Yep, I'm aware as I worked in auto parts stores through school. It was the use of the term "pure coolant" and saying H2O is bad for iron as it causes rust/oxidation which I interpreted as using undiluted concentrate.

Same, and not only have I not seen him say anything to indicate otherwise, his claim to be a chemist would imply his use of the terminology "pure coolant" is exactly what he means.

Poor heat transfer, poor freeze protection, and awful flow due to high viscosity....sounds like a recipe for cracked heads and blocks.

 

[ChasUGC]

There will not be corrosion with a proper mix of distilled water and the proper coolant. The water jacket inside my '92 has no corrosion and the radiator has been in there for 19 years.

100% undiluted antifreeze has less cooling ability than the proper mixture, will freeze at a higher temperature, and in most cases will offer less corrosion protection than the proper mixture as water is required to keep the additives in suspension.

Try thinking of it this way. If you flush your system and then you rinse it with water, it will take 3 quarts of 50/50 to fill it. But, you have 3 quarts of pure water in your engine after the flush and rinse. So, you don't actually have 50/50, you have about 75/25, where 75% is water. Now, if you flush and rinse with water, and add pure coolant, you actually have 50/50. 3 quarts of pure water in your engine, plus 3 quarts of pure coolant, equals 50/50. This is why when I have my system flushed, I use pure coolant. Most people always talk about needing 3 quarts of coolant after a flush, because they never pull their engine plug, so it contains 3 quarts of pure water after the flush and rinse.

Try reading this article. It talks about the corrosive effects of water in the engine. A 75/25 mixture has very low coolant in it, and a high level of the corrosive water.
https://knowhow.napaonline.com/wate...freeze is based on,boiling point of water vs.

 

[ChasUGC]

Same, and not only have I not seen him say anything to indicate otherwise, his claim to be a chemist would imply his use of the terminology "pure coolant" is exactly what he means.

Poor heat transfer, poor freeze protection, and awful flow due to high viscosity....sounds like a recipe for cracked heads and blocks.

You clearly don't understand how the cooling system works. Most people add 3 quarts of 50/50 to fill their cooling system after a flush and rinse. But, they actually have a 75/25 mixture, and not 50/50. If you add pure coolant, you will have a 50/50 mixture, with 3 quarts of pure coolant, and three quarts of the pure water in your engine after the rinse.

 

[JasterMereel42]

Try thinking of it this way. If you flush your system and then you rinse it with water, it will take 3 quarts of 50/50 to fill it. But, you have 3 quarts of pure water in your engine after the flush and rinse. So, you don't actually have 50/50, you have about 75/25, where 75% is water. Now, if you flush and rinse with water, and add pure coolant, you actually have 50/50. 3 quarts of pure water in your engine, plus 3 quarts of pure coolant, equals 50/50. This is why when I have my system flushed, I use pure coolant. Most people always talk about needing 3 quarts of coolant after a flush, because they never pull their engine plug, so it contains 3 quarts of pure water after the flush and rinse.

Try reading this article. It talks about the corrosive effects of water in the engine. A 75/25 mixture has very low coolant in it, and a high level of the corrosive water.
https://knowhow.napaonline.com/wate...freeze is based on,boiling point of water vs.

The 4.0L engine has 4 quarts is the engine block and about 6 quarts in the rest of the system, right? So, if you get to the point where the entire system is pure distilled water, then you drain it the radiator. You fill it back up with pure coolant, and then you should be at 60/40 coolant/water, right?

 

[JKP]

Try thinking of it this way. If you flush your system and then you rinse it with water, it will take 3 quarts of 50/50 to fill it. But, you have 3 quarts of pure water in your engine after the flush and rinse. So, you don't actually have 50/50, you have about 75/25, where 75% is water. Now, if you flush and rinse with water, and add pure coolant, you actually have 50/50. 3 quarts of pure water in your engine, plus 3 quarts of pure coolant, equals 50/50. This is why when I have my system flushed, I use pure coolant. Most people always talk about needing 3 quarts of coolant after a flush, because they never pull their engine plug, so it contains 3 quarts of pure water after the flush and rinse.

Try reading this article. It talks about the corrosive effects of water in the engine. A 75/25 mixture has very low coolant in it, and a high level of the corrosive water.
[URL]https://knowhow.napaonline.com...freeze is based on,boiling point of water vs.[/URL]

I know the capacity of a YJ, TJ cooling system (10.5 qts) and as such I always ensure I have a 50/50 mix.

You said you were running 100% undiluted antifreeze.

 

[JKP]

For the record, here is what the FSM states:
COOLANT PERFORMANCE
The required ethylene-glycol (antifreeze) and water
mixture depends upon climate and vehicle operating
conditions. The coolant performance of various mixtures
follows:
Pure Water- Water can absorb more heat than a
mixture of water and ethylene-glycol. This is for purpose
of heat transfer only. Water also freezes at a
higher temperature and allows corrosion.

100 percent Ethylene-Glycol - The corrosion
inhibiting additives in ethylene-glycol need the presence
of water to dissolve. Without water, additives
form deposits in system. These act as insulation
causing temperature to rise to as high as 149°C
(300°F). This temperature is hot enough to melt plastic
and soften solder. The increased temperature can
result in engine detonation. In addition, 100 percent
ethylene-glycol freezes at -22°C (-8°F).

50/50 Ethylene-Glycol and Water - Is the recommended
mixture, it provides protection against freezing
to -37°C (-34°F). The antifreeze concentration
must always be a minimum of 44 percent, yearround
in all climates. If percentage is lower, engine
parts may be eroded by cavitation. Maximum protection
against freezing is provided with a 68 percent
antifreeze concentration, which prevents freezing
down to -67.7°C (-90°F). A higher percentage will
freeze at a warmer temperature. Also, a higher percentage
of antifreeze can cause the engine to overheat
because specific heat of antifreeze is lower than
that of water.

CAUTION: Richer antifreeze mixtures cannot be
measured with normal field equipment and can
cause problems associated with 100 percent ethylene-
glycol.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

You clearly don't understand how the cooling system works. Most people add 3 quarts of 50/50 to fill their cooling system after a flush and rinse. But, they actually have a 75/25 mixture, and not 50/50. If you add pure coolant, you will have a 50/50 mixture, with 3 quarts of pure coolant, and three quarts of the pure water in your engine after the rinse.

Yeah ok. You have no idea what you're talking about and I don't even know how to help you.

 

[ChasUGC]

Yeah ok. You have no idea what you're talking about and I don't even know how to help you.

Still won't admit you're wrong. It's okay.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Still won't admit you're wrong. It's okay.

Wrong about what? You honestly come in here thinking you're the only one on planet earth that's figured out the block holds some leftover flush water and you can't bring it to 50/50 by adding 50/50? We all know this. We all know how to add straight antifreeze concentrate to get the final mix where we want it. You may also be surprised to realize that most of us know that wet iron will rust without some sort of corrosion inhibition.

So let's get you on record with what you're actually doing. Are you running an engine on straight concentrated antifreeze? Are you adding only concentrated antifreeze to half a gallon of water trapped in the block and ending up with ~80/20% EG/water?

 

[CMBD]

You clearly don't understand how the cooling system works. ...

Still won't admit you're wrong. It's okay.

After reading all of your posts in this thread, these two are comedy gold.

Im fine with total nonsense as long as you bring the lolz.

 

[NskLJ]

I can give you one important piece of advice. Don't mix coolant colors. I've seen horror stories here of Wranglers with mixed coolant colors plugging their cooling systems. My mechanic actually did that on my Wrangler and I was furious. He mixed the green with the orange, and I saw all sorts of cast deposits and gunk in my overflow bottle. I immediately had him flush my system, and I brought brand new green coolant. I have a funny story about it too. This past Wednesday, I got LED lights for my engine compartment. When, I was checking them out on light blue setting, I looked in my overflow bottle, and it was orange. I was so worried. So, I opened my radiator cap, and it was orange too. I was furious. I assumed my mechanic had violated my wishes and our discussion, and put orange coolant back in my radiator. So, the next morning, I drove to his shop really ready to give him a piece of my mind. I stopped in front of his shop, and I opened my hood, and although my Jeep was a little warm, I angrily opened my radiator cap, and all this green coolant came shooting out. I was shocked, but relieved. My mechanic is a nice guy and he is good. I checked my overflow bottle and it was clearly green too. I guess that those light blue LED lights from last night made my coolant look orange. I was so relieved and happy.

I know people talk about 50/50 and 60/40 mixes, but I use only pure coolant. As a Chemist, I know that H2O is a strong killer of iron, has a lower boiling point, and I've had this problem in past radiators where the water would strip the iron from the engine and plug my radiators. So far so good, as my coolant stays clear, it doesn't evaporate fast from losing so much water to steam evaporation, and I have 215,000 miles on my engine. Again, *crosses fingers*.

You might be interested in this product then.
https://www.evanscoolant.com/

 

[TexasTJ2004]

Guys, I am troubled about this “block holds some water stuff”. Block has a drain plug, and this plug is supposed to be used in addition to radiator petcock for properly draining the cooling system.
It just takes 8mm square head to open the drain plug, really not so complicated.
This was after all flushes done, you have drained everything, including all the junk from the block.
Then decide which coolant mixture you want, premix it and fill it up. No leftovers, no mixing with old gunk or flushing water, whatever.
If you do the flushing at home, have to some time to do it properly, then you have to drain the block.

 

[TexasTJ2004]

You might be interested in this product then.
[URL]https://www.evanscoolant.com/[/URL]

If somebody wants to use this Evans Waterless, then draining the block is a complete must. Their coolant cannot be mixed water above small percentage, which is impossible to achieve w/o properly draining the block.

 

[NskLJ]

If somebody wants to use this Evans Waterless, then draining the block is a complete must. Their coolant cannot be mixed water above small percentage, which is impossible to achieve w/o properly draining the block.

They have a procedure to flush remove and test the system for water. I guess they use a 0 psi cap also. I have a buddy who has used it with good results.

 

[KennethS]

We all know how to add straight antifreeze concentrate to get the final mix where we want it.

And some of us of even have a hydrometer to verify we have the desired final mix.

 

[annihil8ted]

+1, 100% coolant concerntrate is wrong. Maybe you meant topping off with pure coolant but if you did, your post didn't indicate that clearly.

Beside, the point isn't to never flush your coolant system so even if water is in the least corrosive, flushing it out and replacing with the right concentration of coolant regularly will ensure the system will last longer than the vehicle itself. All parts to a degree are wear items after all

 

[hear]

Guys, I am troubled about this “block holds some water stuff”. Block has a drain plug, and this plug is supposed to be used in addition to radiator petcock for properly draining the cooling system.
It just takes 8mm square head to open the drain plug, really not so complicated.
This was after all flushes done, you have drained everything, including all the junk from the block.
Then decide which coolant mixture you want, premix it and fill it up. No leftovers, no mixing with old gunk or flushing water, whatever.
If you do the flushing at home, have to some time to do it properly, then you have to drain the block.

Just to add more fun & games to the mix, Mr. Blaine stated here last week (?) that he NEVER drains the block. He detailed his process, and specifically said he doesn't do that step nor will he ever.

 

[JasterMereel42]

Just to add more fun & games to the mix, Mr. Blaine stated here last week (?) that he NEVER drains the block. He detailed his process, and specifically said he doesn't do that step nor will he ever.

https://wranglertjforum.com/threads/cooling-system-cleanliness.72024/page-5#post-1368504
I'm at the "we pull the thermostat and put the housing back on" step today.

 

[JKP]

Just to add more fun & games to the mix, Mr. Blaine stated here last week (?) that he NEVER drains the block. He detailed his process, and specifically said he doesn't do that step nor will he ever.

I've never drained the block on any engine. If you keep the cooling system in good shape, there's no need to.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Just to add more fun & games to the mix, Mr. Blaine stated here last week (?) that he NEVER drains the block. He detailed his process, and specifically said he doesn't do that step nor will he ever.

correct. and the justification is that after 3 flushes (assuming you run each one long enough to be thoroughly mixed) leaves about 1.5% of what was left in the block.

Drain and fill 1: 25% old/75% new
Drain and fill 2: 25% of 25% (6.25%) old/93.75% new
drain and fill 3: 25% of 6.25% (1.5%) old/98.5% new

Given that the drain is still in front of cylinders 5 and 6, it doesn't obviate the need for repeated flushes and refills. It makes each one more effective, but I'm not sure it does enough to do less than 3 anyway, and it adds the complication of either having my hands in very close proximity to catalytic converters, or fishing it in and out of there on the end of socket extensions trying not to cross thread it or drop it into a bucket of hot flush water.