Factor 55 flat link vs standard winch hook

[Sundowner]

Is the hawse fairlead preferable to use with synthetic line vs a roller style fairlead? Is that more for steel line?

Hawse fairleads are required for synthetic line, and synthetic line is required for a hawse fairlead: they're a matched pair. Likewise, steel and rollers go together; you can use synthetic in a roller fairlead, but you're likely to get it pinched in a corner, which can lead to failure. Steel line in a aluminum hawse fairlead will quickly cause damage of one sort or another, either to the line or to the fairlead.

Edit: just for clarity, this is my OPINION.

 

[jazngab]

Hawse fairleads are required for synthetic line, and synthetic line is required for a hawse fairlead: they're a matched pair. Likewise, steel and rollers go together; you can use synthetic in a roller fairlead, but you're likely to get it pinched in a corner, which can lead to failure. Steel line in a hawse fairlead will quickly cause damage of one sort or another, either to the line or to the fairlead.

Ok. Another noobie question. Are line dampeners still necessary using synthetic line? All how to winching videos use them but one of the pros of synthetic rope is it doesn’t store energy and drops to the ground.

 

[jjvw]

Is the hawse fairlead preferable to use with synthetic line vs a roller style fairlead? Is that more for steel line?

Either can work. The larger the radius the better. A steel cable needs a steel hawse. There is a good argument that rollers are best regardless of the type of rope. For synthetic, the hawse or rollers need to be free of gouges and burrs.

 

[jjvw]

Ok. Another noobie question. Are line dampeners still necessary using synthetic line? All how to winching videos use them but one of the pros of synthetic rope is it doesn’t store energy and drops to the ground.

A synthetic rope has less stretch and less weight than steel cable. It is best to assume that it will still recoil. But rather than taking a limb off, you'll suffer a nasty cut or bruise. They are not harmless if they break. This is why it is encouraged to use minimal connections that are also lightweight and soft. Winching is dangerous and should never be assumed that it isn't.

 

[jjvw]

...The safety thimble fairlead does move it out of the way but I'd be really nervous without a spotter with the rope exposed like that.

...

 

[Sundowner]

Either can work. The larger the radius the better. A steel cable needs a steel hawse. There is a good argument that rollers are best regardless of the type of rope. For synthetic, the hawse or rollers need to be free of gouges and burrs.

If you're going to use rollers with synthetic, then you need to make sure that they have a heavy overlap at the corners and that they turn freely, in addition to making them burr/scratch-free. That's why I don't like them...that and the fact that they're bigger and heavier than is necessary, and they stick out further. Hawse fairleads are lighter, simpler, and smaller. That's why I like the TRE fairlead that goes with the safety thimble: it has the proper radius for the rope and the rear opening is larger than the front, so the rope is never back-dragged across the rear edge (there's a thread somewhere on here dealing with that). So, personal opinion: rollers for steel, hawse for synthetic.

 

[Sundowner]

I like that little out-of-the-way thimble mount.

 

[jjvw]

I like that little out-of-the-way thimble mount.

It amuses me how often people ask if I have a winch. I've hidden all the tell tale signs that it's there.

 

[Sundowner]

It amuses me how often people ask if I have a winch. I've hidden all the tell tale signs that it's there.

They seriously ask you that? There's a big-ass hawse and a winch rope right on the front-

... nevermind. I have no doubt that people ask. I was giving too much credit again.

 

[jjvw]

They seriously ask you that? There's a big-ass hawse and a winch rope right on the front-

... nevermind. I have no doubt that people ask. I was giving too much credit again.

Enough for me to notice. Probably the same people who want enormous hooks and shackles on every ring.

 

[Mike_H]

You know how to splice? Great, that makes this much simpler:

I think Samson suggests 72 times the diameter, which is 3.5 fids, and a taper on alternating fifth and sixth pairs; look that info up to verify it, because it might be a fever dream on my part. Fids are handy for measuring, but you don't need one on Dyneema; cut the taper and then wrap it with tape, spiraling towards the point, and use that as your fid. Bury the taper into the core of the line further than you think you need, cinch the eye tight around the thimble, pull the tape, strip the taper into the core, milk the splice down, and set it HARD; like, go rig a strap around a telephone pole and use the winch to slowly build tension on the splice. Once it's set, that's it; you're basically done. If you run chafing gear on the line, either install it BEFORE you splice, or pull the entire line and slide it on from the rear; if you run it from the rear with the line off the spool, it's a good time to wash the line and fluff it up a bit before you respool it. You can also run a separate sleeve of chafe guard around the line at the spool to keep the heat off the line...or just wrap the spool itself. It's a good time to shorten your line, too, if need be.

So you don't do a Brummel Lock or Lock stitch? Just rely on the memory of the cord to keep the free end tight? I guess the only chance for the eye splice to loosen is when your spooling line out...and with the TRE thimble, it can't actually fall out of the loop, so maybe its unnecessary.

 

[jjvw]

So you don't do a Brummel Lock or Lock stitch? Just rely on the memory of the cord to keep the free end tight? I guess the only chance for the eye splice to loosen is when your spooling line out...and with the TRE thimble, it can't actually fall out of the loop, so maybe its unnecessary.

Mine is a Brummel with a stitch.

 

[Sundowner]

So you don't do a Brummel Lock or Lock stitch? Just rely on the memory of the cord to keep the free end tight? I guess the only chance for the eye splice to loosen is when your spooling line out...and with the TRE thimble, it can't actually fall out of the loop, so maybe its unnecessary.

You can do a Brummel if you like, but it's not really necessary; once the splice is set with the winch and the vehicle weight, it's not coming out. A Long Bury is like the ultimate Chinese finger trap, except that there's no trick for getting it loose. So, it doesn't matter if the line is going out or coming in or just laying on the spool; until you work at manually loosening the splice - and that's actually kind of hard to do, because there's nothing to push against - it's going to stay where you set it. Lock stitches are about as useful as a Brummel; they hold things until tension is applied, and then they don't really make a difference. That said, do what makes you feel all warm and fuzzy; as long as the splice is correct, it'll be fine.

 

[FireJeep]

Another option for abrasion protection is to use rope rescue edge pro that has velcro closure. Then you only put it on when and where you need it. Sometimes having a piece of tubular webbing permanently on the winch line is a pain, it does not alway feed into the fairlead well and can get bunched up....... You could avoid splicing all together and just cut the eye of the hook off, you then maintain the factory splice etc. Of course this is assuming you like the thimble that is on your rope.

Masterpull is what I have as well, they started out as a marine industry supply, their stuff is pretty much UV and everything else resistant. Trivial info, they make a line that is 2" in diameter and rated to a million pounds!!!! pretty impressive......

 

[Sundowner]

Fun Fact: the newest Dyneema is made up to almost 7" in diameter, with a 3.9 million pound rating.

 

[Drizit]

The rope IS stable; that's why I sarcastically said "you can protect your UV-stabilized synthetic line from the damaging effects of UV light" in my previous post.

If you're hitting an obstacle thimble-first, you have a much more serious risk than scratching a section of your rope: you run the risk of hitting the fairlead. The rope is easily protected with chafing gear; avoiding fairlead damage takes a little more work.

Sorry meant to type was not wasn't doh.

I don't think any amount of abrasion sleeve is going to save the rope if it gets jammed between a rock and a jeep slipping off that rock. Then again doing that to a thimble may well result in a cut rope as well, seeing as it's not an ideal thing for shearing forces.

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Nice, that's way cheaper to

Fun Fact: the newest Dyneema is made up to almost 7" in diameter, with a 3.9 million pound rating.

Now that's just nuts... I don't think I want to drag that up the hill behind me to hook up to a tree

—
There must have been a time
when we could have said no.

 

[Drizit]

Hawse fairleads are required for synthetic line, and synthetic line is required for a hawse fairlead: they're a matched pair. Likewise, steel and rollers go together; you can use synthetic in a roller fairlead, but you're likely to get it pinched in a corner, which can lead to failure. Steel line in a hawse fairlead will quickly cause damage of one sort or another, either to the line or to the fairlead.

Had a Warn M10000 that came new in the box with steel line and a steel hawse fairlead. It's not a common setup to be sure but they do exist. I'm now using that fairlead with synthetic (it never got used with the steel even once) although at some point I'll probably replace it and the back edge isn't rounded enough for my liking and could create a bit of a small radus point on vertical offsets.

—
There must have been a time
when we could have said no.

 

[jimsmith29841]

You have a thimble. It's the supporting metal loop at the end of the rope. I also have a thimble. And its a thimble that does what F55 pretends to do.

My soft shackles have a breaking strength of 30k lbs. I trust that they are safe for my use.

I trust a soft shackle to metal any day, just for the fact that I would rather be around a soft shackle when it snaps than a metal shackle.

 

[mrblaine]

So you don't do a Brummel Lock or Lock stitch? Just rely on the memory of the cord to keep the free end tight? I guess the only chance for the eye splice to loosen is when your spooling line out...and with the TRE thimble, it can't actually fall out of the loop, so maybe its unnecessary.

We don't use either the Brummel or lock stitch. After you do some splicing and figure out how hard it is to dig the buried tail out of a splice that has been loaded, all you do after a splice is load it. It will lock it down very securely and the lock stitch is just for vandals and shipping. They are not at all anything related to a loose connection after you load them once.

 

[mrblaine]

Be careful with your thimble and the hawse fairlead. If the hawse is aluminum and you suck the thimble through the opening, you will gouge the hawse and create the potential to tear up the rope. Oddly enough, Factor 55 creates this scenario. It's a terribly unsafe product on several fronts.

Warn does it as well, terrible way to do things.