I'd love to hear @starkey480's input. I think he's still running 35s on a super 35 and last I read was keeping up with buggies out in Arizona.
Help with Gears and Lockers
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OP
Here are the numbers I've found. Someone show me cheaper if you know. Remember, my main goal is cost effective solution for 33s. I'm not going to 35s. Based on what I've read I also like the idea of leaving the rear open for now to save money to do the rear like I want. However, I want to change to 456 gears which means I need new carriers. I don't want to buy an open carrier set only to take it out six months later for a trutrac and have to pay to get the axle setup again. I'm definitely in a pickle.
Keep my 35c
$1200- Super 35 kit (includes trutrac carrier and bearings and 1541 shafts)
$150-$200 for R&P
$500 for shop fees
Dana 44 swap
$1200ish for the axle that may or may not come with gears or locker I need
$400 for locker if not included
$150-200 for R&P
$500 for shop fees
I think the super 35 kit only works with the air lockers or a detroit and there aren't any limited-slip options? If you want to run a limited slip safely you might need the Dana 44 which seems odd to me but I don't make the parts.
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Willhugh
Member
Since a significant portion of the cost is in the install, I'd figure out exactly how you want it done and do it all at once, even if that means saving for a few more months. Those prices seem about right, maybe a little high on the super 35 kit - I'm seeing the axle shafts for $300, and the Truetrac for $500. Assuming there might be some additional bearings etc. that need to be purchased though.
Your total cost for the 35 and the 44 might end up being similar, but I believe I've read the super 35 shafts are stronger than the factory 44 shafts. You'd only be adding more weight and losing clearance by going to the larger axle. Limited to 35 inch tires with both setups, so I don't personally see much benefit to a 44.
Willhugh
Member
For what it's worth, I'm dealing with the same dilemma. Have started purchasing parts for a super 35 with an Eaton e-locker.
I don't see the pickle here. You are not broken. Your rig runs and drives OK at the moment. You can likely do all of your current offroad plans as it sits. Take some time, save up the money to do it right the first time. Do your gears and lockers / LSD, rear axle solution at the same time. This will save you money and get you what you want. Why such a hurry?
Jeff
OP
What I'm seeing is the kits usually have ARB, OX, and Detroit (clutch type) available in 30 spline. You can also buy a trutrac in 30 spline separately. But if you get the parts and add all the bearings it ends up close to 1200 which is where I got that number. Rusty's has a kit with Detroit, Ten axles, and bearings for around 1000.
OP
The gears are what's bothering me. With 3.07 in it right now I have no power, no 5th gear, and it's hard to drive to trails on the highway. Once I'm on the trails it's fine.
Who has a Super 35 kit with a Truetrac? That's not a common option for a Super 35 since a Truetrac (a limited slip differential) doesn't put nearly as much stress on the axle shafts as a locker like a Detroit Locker does.
Somebody's got something wrong there for sure. Pretty sure 30 spline Dana 35 TrueTracs were available briefly way back when the super 35 was born, but they have been long gone for a while now, if they were ever even real. I can't confirm they were.
OP
I was looking at the 44, apologies. The kits I was looking at have either the Yukon grizzly or the Detroit noslip which are both clutch type, not torsion.
https://ktperformance.net/i-1447399...SKjF55AnROVwU8XrKYjF6Vx34WBcEL6YaAqeCEALw_wcB
https://www.rustysoffroad.com/ten-factory-super-35-kit-with-detroit-or-arb-air-locker.html
Mobusaki
TJ Enthusiast
For what you describe you'll be well served with just a front lunchbox. If it's no rocks, light to moderate wheeling, trails and sand, a front lunchbox and open rear should get you everywhere you want to go and then some - that would be my recommendation if you stick with the 35. And for 33's, I think an open dana 35 should be good to go.
If you plan to ever wheel harder or go larger tire size, then consider an axle swap or super 35.
As for the Truetracs, I have them front and rear and they are perfect for me because I drive on snowy roads. A front lunchbox and open rear would give you more overall capability offroad, IMO. In particular, I would not put a Truetrac in a Dana 35 unless I was driving on snowy roads often, and I would want to upgrade the 27 spline axles at that point. I don't think the cost of that is justified in a non-super 35, again, in my opinion.
If you plan to ever wheel harder or go larger tire size, then consider an axle swap or super 35.
As for the Truetracs, I have them front and rear and they are perfect for me because I drive on snowy roads. A front lunchbox and open rear would give you more overall capability offroad, IMO. In particular, I would not put a Truetrac in a Dana 35 unless I was driving on snowy roads often, and I would want to upgrade the 27 spline axles at that point. I don't think the cost of that is justified in a non-super 35, again, in my opinion.
Just to clarify, the grizzly is a locker, not a limited slip. I have one in my 30 front and it's worked like a champ so far.
The usual auto locker caveats apply when running one in the rear.
The usual auto locker caveats apply when running one in the rear.
There is no such thing as a Detroit noslip: https://www.eaton.com/us/en-us/prod...action-control/aftermarket-differentials.html . There is a Detroit no-spin which is basically a Detroit Locker without the case and it is only made for heavy duty applications: https://www.eaton.com/content/dam/e...rol/nospin/eaton-nospin-application-guide.pdf .
OP
I wouldn't buy anything from Rusty's. Rusty has earned a bad reputation that started many years ago for not taking care of his customers after the sale.
I didn't create the below meme that shows the general feelings about him and his products.
OP
Their kit is confirmed to not be 1541 axles, which explains the cost with an e locker. I would probably buy the parts individually.
If any Super 35 kit you find comes with anything but 1541H axle shafts steer clear of it. 1541H shafts are the only type of shafts that will hold up in a Dana 35.
This is what happens to a non-1541H shaft, like if it was made from 4340, in a Dana 35. You can see the outer axle bearings wore right through the 4340 shaft's outer layer due to insufficient surface hardening like the 1541H has.
What would be "super" about it without the 1541 shafts?
You didn't mention what tire size you plan on running, I'm still curious there...
And fair enough - I like messing around with things for nothing else but the sake of messing with things. That said, on a rig that I wheel and would wheel hard enough to warrant such meticulous work, I certainly wouldn't run such a bastardized setup with everything requiring custom parts (like your rear axle shafts for example).
The biggest Dana 44 axle tubes that I know of are the 76-79 HP versions, which come with 3" x 1/2" tube. Every D60KP axle I've ever worked on has a 3.125" x 1/2" tube. Not sure how you're going to make that work but even still, I see no point in spending the time (even with free parts) as GM flattop knuckles and any of the aftermarket versions are plenty strong and have been wheeled heavily on 37" tires with full-sized (read "heavier"!) rigs without much issue. You can gain all of the advantages of losing the axle bearings and getting manual hubs simply by retaining the Dana 44 stuff. You also get notably better brakes that are more easily adapted to work with the TJ's booster and master size. I'm not sure where you're getting bigger u-joints from, as all late model Dana 44's utilize the 297x joint (same as the factory TJ). The Jana 54 kit can be tedious but I have heard nothing but good things and Carl is a good guy.
For the rear axle, I still do not see what advantage the work brings to you. The factory 14B brakes won't work with your factory brake setup without a lot of work. You can of course run aftermarket JB6 or El Dorado calipers but they really offer no advantage in braking over the factory discs, and then you still have to make the e-brakes work with the factory setup. There is no denying the strength of FF 14B axle shafts, but unless you're upgrading the 8.8's carrier to something bigger, you'll never notice the advantage of a full float conversion, particularly in a <4000 lb rig. I believe this is why all the "full foat conversions" of the 90's era died off soon after being released (but perhaps I'm missing something).
Seems like you're trying best to balance clearance and strength, while getting some width (but not necessarily full width). I'm having a hard time seeing how your setup would be advantageous more so than a comparably built D44HP/F8.8 from a full-size Bronco or similar. I mean hell if you already have a D60KP and 14B FF around, you might as well go big or go home - you can easily narrow a Dana 60 to Dana 44 full-size width (65-67" depending) and can use wheels with more BS to bring it even narrower together. You can then shave the 14B as much as you can and run the appropriate hubs/wheel combo to get a width you want.
I have always wanted to narrow a D60HP/60HD combo to ~65.5" (with a 64.5" Dodge rear) and run that with a stretched SWB rig. I was headed that direction with my YJ at the time but ended up getting my old TJ which I ended up liking a lot (A/C is nice in Arizona lol). I still think that a somewhat narrow rig on 37-38" tires with a 101-103" WB would work very well in AZ trails. Now that I'm back in the east coast, I'd be more inclined to just run a set of SD axles full width and go with high BS wheels.