Thoughts on Optima batteries?
- Thread starter cradkins_9591502
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"Built-in jump start (OPTIMA CPR) automatically disconnects your battery when it's being drained and reserves enough power to start your vehicle, and can be automatically activated with the OPTIMA Bluetooth app."
See @Zorba? If the battery dies you can give yourself a jump without leaving your seat! Just use the app on your phooooone....
The other important part is it only weighs 20 lbs.
Or you could buy a Napa Legends AGM , likely never need a jump start , and have over $600.00 in your pocket .
Northstar batteries (before they got bought out by Odyssey) did note that their batteries charged best in the 14.2 to 14.8V range. I seem to recall they even preferred the higher end of that range around 14.6V.
I set my charging voltage to 14.38V (14.4 rounds to that in HP Tuners) which is fairly typical for a modern AGM charging setpoint, at least for a single-setpoint charging voltage.
Modern cars with active BMS will generally bulk charge right at 14.4V, and then once reaching a set battery charge state (usually in the range of 75-80%) will drop as low as 13.7V depending on the accessory load. They will also ramp up to 15.2-15.3V on vehicle deceleration, which effectively charges the battery with a crude form of regenerative braking, and also serves as the de-sulfation cycle.
The TJ PCM has a battery setpoint which is adjusted based on the battery temperature sensor output. This would be fine, except that in at least some cases (like mine) where there is no battery temperature sensor, it defaults to the lowest voltage, which is right around 13.8V. Enough to basically trickle charge the battery or recover it from a very low state of charge but not enough to fully charge it in a normal cycle, and may result in early sulfation.
Interestingly, the Wranglerfix PCM had the opposite logic and charged at the maximum setpoint without the battery temperature sensor, which I seem to recall is about 14.6-14.7V.
When I adjusted the setpoints, I made it one flat curve with all values set to 14.38V since there is no battery temperature sensor in mine. With a battery temperature sensor, a milder curve than factory might be suitable for AGM.
Ideal charging voltage does in fact change with temperature (negative correlation), hence why some TJs had a battery temperature sensor in the first place. AGMs may be somewhat more resistant to overcharging than flooded cell, so setting a higher rate is less likely to damage them. Setting ~14.4V is almost always a safe bet except for the hottest of batteries.
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My issue with Optima is both philosophical and from many experiences. If a rig came in with Optima in it, I knew at some point it was going to not start due to a crap battery. If it had dual batteries, that jumped up to almost 100%. I have battery tenders, I use them, made no difference.
The second part is Optima Jim on Pirate. He hopped on there to address the many complaints about Optima quality. What we learned from him is you can NOT use a red top to winch with, you need a yellow. My problem with that is he basically just said that the average crap flooded lead acid battery that 1000's of us have winched with is a far better battery than a red top.
All I know for sure is if you let an AGM sit discharged for even 24 hours, good luck getting it to work again. I've messed with dozens of them, they have never come back and I may not know all the tricks, but I know a lot of them and none of them work very well.
I'm pretty fed up with AGM batteries at this point. Currently running whatever Sam's sells and they've replaced it for me twice, no questions asked, over the last 3 years I've owned it. If I don't keep them on a charger they won't last.
My experiences are not much different. I'm running the Costco Napa version which has to be returned to Costco for warranty replacement. I have a pair that lasted a year on the way there today. And yet again, just like the Batteries + Northstars I bought, they did not tell me very clearly that they have to go back to place of purchase which is not as convenient as I'd like it to be. I'm sure it was in the fine print somewhere, I just didn't see it.
That said, I'll still take AGM over dealing with liquid acid and all the corrosion issues but only for that reason.
I'll guess circa '09-'12. I had 2 failures of new Optimas during that time before going back to a standard battery. The same car had just got a typical 7-8 year life out of an Optima from the early '00s. I have friends who experienced the same during that time.
I definitely see the benefit but it also makes me want to look into something like an antigravity.
Being a cheap ass pays off again, my duralast gold still going 4.5y later and my jeep sits outside all year. I don't know if it even costed 100$
I don’t see a need to buy expensive AGM batteries for vehicles. Standard batteries work fine for me. I typically replace them 1 year past their full warranty replacement (usually 3 years). It’s excessive but I don’t care. I don’t like being stranded with a bad battery. I also carry a fully charged jump pack as well as jumper cables.
I do run AGM batteries on my ATVs and haven’t had any issues there.
Just like any product, there are cheaply made and bad AGMs, and there are really good ones.
There are only two brands/lines I highly recommend. These are the Odyssey Extreme series and the Deka Intimidator series.
Odyssey ODX (Extreme) Series - these are the legacy NorthStar AGM batteries.
Group 24 with dual normal and marine terminals: https://www.odysseybattery.com/products/odx-agm24m-battery-nsb-agm24m/
(Currently out of stock on their website but in stock at various resellers.)
Group 34 with dual normal and marine terminals:
https://www.odysseybattery.com/products/odx-agm34m-battery-34m-pc1500st/
Group 24 batteries fit the late-style TJ with zero modifications. Older TJs with the over-the-top battery clamp will require modifications to the clamp.
I highly recommend the dual terminal models. All of your factory loads can be hooked up to the automotive terminals. But then you have separate high quality stud terminals that can be used for wiring a winch, an upgraded ground wire, extra fuse/relay bus, etc.
Odyssey Extreme batteries are made in Missouri.
Deka Intimidator series - These are East Penn's highest end battery. Often rebranded and sold under OEM labels as well.
Group 34:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=8936992&cc=0&pt=2476
These can usually be found on RockAuto at a very good price.
Group 34 with dual automotive and marine terminals:
https://www.batterymart.com/p-Mega-Crank-Marine-AGM-Battery.html
Harder to find as cheap as the normal series but also have the dual terminals like the NorthStar/Odyssey batteries.
Deka Intimidator batteries are made in Pennsylvania (or possibly Iowa).
There are only two brands/lines I highly recommend. These are the Odyssey Extreme series and the Deka Intimidator series.
Odyssey ODX (Extreme) Series - these are the legacy NorthStar AGM batteries.
Group 24 with dual normal and marine terminals: https://www.odysseybattery.com/products/odx-agm24m-battery-nsb-agm24m/
(Currently out of stock on their website but in stock at various resellers.)
Group 34 with dual normal and marine terminals:
https://www.odysseybattery.com/products/odx-agm34m-battery-34m-pc1500st/
Group 24 batteries fit the late-style TJ with zero modifications. Older TJs with the over-the-top battery clamp will require modifications to the clamp.
I highly recommend the dual terminal models. All of your factory loads can be hooked up to the automotive terminals. But then you have separate high quality stud terminals that can be used for wiring a winch, an upgraded ground wire, extra fuse/relay bus, etc.
Odyssey Extreme batteries are made in Missouri.
Deka Intimidator series - These are East Penn's highest end battery. Often rebranded and sold under OEM labels as well.
Group 34:
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=8936992&cc=0&pt=2476
These can usually be found on RockAuto at a very good price.
Group 34 with dual automotive and marine terminals:
https://www.batterymart.com/p-Mega-Crank-Marine-AGM-Battery.html
Harder to find as cheap as the normal series but also have the dual terminals like the NorthStar/Odyssey batteries.
Deka Intimidator batteries are made in Pennsylvania (or possibly Iowa).
Flooded LA batteries have a lot going for them. Besides being inexpensive they handle suboptimal charging quite well. They're a great option when you don't need a sealed battery.
You do you, but that's expensive. My batteries average 7-8 years, and I run them until the first sign of issue. I currently have two Oreillys batteries creeping up on 10 years, one of those is an AGM in my Jeep from '16.
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My Yellow top lasted 3-4 years and died just inside warranty - so I got a second for free. to be fair it never failed to start the jeep, just slow cranked and barely started.
That being said, 4 or even 6 years is kinda shit for a quality AGM - I am in Texas so I expect a shorter lifespan. My next battery will either be Northstar or Oddessy.
That being said, 4 or even 6 years is kinda shit for a quality AGM - I am in Texas so I expect a shorter lifespan. My next battery will either be Northstar or Oddessy.
It's kinda weird that we all have had different experiences with AGM's . The Napa Legend in my 99 was installed in 2010 , no issues. The same thing on our 2004 , installed in 2020 . I did have a Optima red top that was in our 98 4Runner when we got it , wouldn't hold a charge at 5 years old. Not having Acid and corrosion trying to get out , make an AGM even better in my rough road environment.