Towing with a TJ

[GATORB8]

Weight is a non-issue.
The Jeep Cherokee XJ typically weighs between 2,900 and 3,400 lbs, while the Jeep Wrangler TJ ranges from about 3,080 to 3,700 lbs, depending on engine, trim, and modifications.

Not that it's the determining factor here, but, while the experience is normally better with a heavier tow vehicle, given a set drivetrain and suspension, the lighter vehicle is normally rated to tow more because it has higher payload available.

For example, a base half ton is normally significantly higher rated than a high end/loaded out version of the same truck.

 

[The Ontario jeeper]

So it seems that there is more at play than just wheelbase and weight. Most people think it’s purely wheelbase but I knew that couldn’t be it given the XJ and LJ similarities in that regard. Seems suspension, transmission, wheelbase all play a role in this.

I’m not looking to tow with my TJ I was just curious about this subject and I want to thank everyone here for having a civil conversation on this matter ( as we know the internet can be touchy with certain subjects )

 

[Gilaguy23]

I'm wondering if it could be partly for liability reasons, it appears that no Jeep model throughout all the years with a soft top option is rated to tow over 3,500 lbs and all the shorter wheelbase ones 2,000 lbs. Kind of like U-Haul who won't rent you a trailer if you don't have a hard top, and won't rent trailers to be towed with convertibles.

Dont forget the 55mph max posted on the side of every U haul trailer.

 

[bucky]

Sure you can pull it. The question is can you control and stop it in an emergency situation? Tongue weight is a major limiting factor. 10-15% of trailer weight should be on the tongue for stability. My 08 Sierra 1500 is rated to tow 10K lbs but if I hook up my 7K lbs car hauler the rear sags to the point of almost hitting the bump stops.
Most owners manuals say properly equipped trailers. This means brakes on the trailer and a load distributing hitch. The manual states using a LDH for trailers over 1K lbs.
Factor in a lift. Not only does a trailer place a longitudinal load on the tow vehicle but it imposes a lateral load also. A lift multiplies this force the higher it is.
Other factors to consider are wheel base of the tow vehicle, rear axle load rating, class rating of the receiver, frontal and side area of the trailer for wind load (my 05 manual state no more than 25 sqft) and distance from the hitch to the axel on the trailer. The manual also state to change the fluid and filter in the trans every 60K miles if regularly towing more than 45 min at a time.
I’ve towed trailers hundreds of thousands of miles across the country over the years with the only issues being blown tires, the occasional spun wheel bearing and 1 blown trans on my 95 F350 pulling a 6% grade pulling a 18K lb 9’ tall box car hauler.

 

[GATORB8]

Sure you can pull it. The question is can you control and stop it in an emergency situation? Tongue weight is a major limiting factor. 10-15% of trailer weight should be on the tongue for stability. My 08 Sierra 1500 is rated to tow 10K lbs but if I hook up my 7K lbs car hauler the rear sags to the point of almost hitting the bump stops.
Most owners manuals say properly equipped trailers. This means brakes on the trailer and a load distributing hitch. The manual states using a LDH for trailers over 1K lbs.
Factor in a lift. Not only does a trailer place a longitudinal load on the tow vehicle but it imposes a lateral load also. A lift multiplies this force the higher it is.
Other factors to consider are wheel base of the tow vehicle, rear axle load rating, class rating of the receiver, frontal and side area of the trailer for wind load (my 05 manual state no more than 25 sqft) and distance from the hitch to the axel on the trailer. The manual also state to change the fluid and filter in the trans every 60K miles if regularly towing more than 45 min at a time.
I’ve towed trailers hundreds of thousands of miles across the country over the years with the only issues being blown tires, the occasional spun wheel bearing and 1 blown trans on my 95 F350 pulling a 6% grade pulling a 18K lb 9’ tall box car hauler.

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View attachment 686706

You already touched on it, but properly loading the trailer to get the correct tongue weight is something you see done incorrectly all the time. Proper loading has a huge impact on how the load pulls. Also, it's important to get the trailer level when its hooked (especially with tandems) and properly set the brake controller.

Doesn't matter how big and bad your truck is if you load the trailer in a way that it can control the truck.

 

[Zorba]

You don't need a trailer if you buy an XJ with leaf springs. So stable. I wouldn't try this with a TJ.

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That guy just does NOT care!

 

[The Ontario jeeper]

Sure you can pull it. The question is can you control and stop it in an emergency situation? Tongue weight is a major limiting factor. 10-15% of trailer weight should be on the tongue for stability. My 08 Sierra 1500 is rated to tow 10K lbs but if I hook up my 7K lbs car hauler the rear sags to the point of almost hitting the bump stops.
Most owners manuals say properly equipped trailers. This means brakes on the trailer and a load distributing hitch. The manual states using a LDH for trailers over 1K lbs.
Factor in a lift. Not only does a trailer place a longitudinal load on the tow vehicle but it imposes a lateral load also. A lift multiplies this force the higher it is.
Other factors to consider are wheel base of the tow vehicle, rear axle load rating, class rating of the receiver, frontal and side area of the trailer for wind load (my 05 manual state no more than 25 sqft) and distance from the hitch to the axel on the trailer. The manual also state to change the fluid and filter in the trans every 60K miles if regularly towing more than 45 min at a time.
I’ve towed trailers hundreds of thousands of miles across the country over the years with the only issues being blown tires, the occasional spun wheel bearing and 1 blown trans on my 95 F350 pulling a 6% grade pulling a 18K lb 9’ tall box car hauler.

View attachment 686705

View attachment 686706

I’m personally not looking to get anywhere close to the TJ’s rating, it was just a thought I had where I questioned why the LJ specifically is rated less than the XJ considering it both weighs more and has a slightly longer wheelbase. Thanks to the replies in this thread I’ve come to understand there’s more at play like suspension, gear ratio, transmission ect. The most I’ll ever tow with my TJ is my little boat which weighs less than 1000 lbs fully loaded

 

[GATORB8]

I’m personally not looking to get anywhere close to the TJ’s rating, it was just a thought I had where I questioned why the LJ specifically is rated less than the XJ considering it both weighs more and has a slightly longer wheelbase. Thanks to the replies in this thread I’ve come to understand there’s more at play like suspension, gear ratio, transmission ect. The most I’ll ever tow with my TJ is my little boat which weighs less than 1000 lbs fully loaded

Another oddball, this is at play on newer wranglers as well, is the LJ hitch is rated as a Class II, compared to the Class III on the tow package XJ.

Normally a class II is a 1.25" receiver, but, at least on the newer wranglers, it's upsized to a 2" reciever for accessory/mount compatibility. In either size, Class II has a 350 lb TW limit.

With the lower payload rating of the TJ/LJ, say 800 lbs. A 500 lb tongue weight would only leave you 300 lbs for passengers and cargo. Of course, that may make a great excuse for the wife and kids to stay home.

 

[hear]

That guy just does NOT care!

He bought an XJ. He already announced that to the world.

 

[KennethS]

I'm wondering if it could be partly for liability reasons,

This may play a part in it. One of my vehicles is a European make and the exact same vehicle in Europe has a higher tow rating. Same everything except country of use.

 

[CharlesHS]

My guess, and what Iv read is a 4 cyl XJ is maxed at 2000lbs, with the 4.0., auto, HD cooling and trans cooler (tow pkg) are OK for 5000. Maybe Jeep didn't wanna blur the lines of people who cant figure out what they have and stated 2000lbs is it on a TJ, YJ or LJ. Having had 5 XJ's, all pre 99, I dont recall any of them having lover then 3.55 gears if not the 3.73's. Im sure the 3.07 in many TJ's would suck.

Just to clarify; there were also 4.0L XJs that came with 3.07 gears and 2.5L XJs that came with 4.56 gears.

 

[CharlesHS]

The XJ weighs approximately 350 lbs more than a TJ and the LJ weight almost 500 lbs more than a TJ.
For some reason there is a difference when towing with a soft top and a hard top; I have not found out why.

 

[TheBoogieman]

He bought an XJ. He already announced that to the world.

Hey now! I still miss my last 99' XJ.

 

[TheBoogieman]

Just to clarify; there were also 4.0L XJs that came with 3.07 gears and 2.5L XJs that came with 4.56 gears.

Gearing

3.07 - used with 4.0L engine / manual transmission
3.31 - only available on older (pre87?) 2 door XJs with "Fuel Economy" package
3.55 - used with 4.0L engine / automatic transmission
3.73 - found in some XJs with the towing package
4.10 - used with 2.5L engine usually, and older XJs with the "Off-Highway Vehicle" package.
4.56 - rare but can be found on some older (~ 89 ~) models with 2.5L engine and auto transmission

 

[CharlesHS]

Hey now! I still miss my last 99' XJ.
View attachment 686775

Sometimes I miss my '98 XJ.

 

[GATORB8]

This may play a part in it. One of my vehicles is a European make and the exact same vehicle in Europe has a higher tow rating. Same everything except country of use.

From what I've read, the Euro requirements are very different (due to often different use cases).

1. Around half the tongue weight percentage - this is crazy to me and would be dangerous for us. 4-7%!
2. Assume speed limited to 100 kph/~60 mph - that changes a ton.
3. Assume almost universal use of trailer brakes.

 

[The Ontario jeeper]

The XJ weighs approximately 350 lbs more than a TJ and the LJ weight almost 500 lbs more than a TJ.
For some reason there is a difference when towing with a soft top and a hard top; I have not found out why.

That was where my initial confusion on the subject came up. A LJ is very close to a XJ as far as weight and wheelbase goes. Same motor ( talking about XJ’s with the tow package ) really the big differences are transmission as the XJ’s tow package used a aw4 with a cooler and rear suspension leafs vs coils. Other than that what could realistically be limiting a LJ?

TJ’s and XJ’s shared front suspension and if you had 3:73’s or even better a rubi with 4:10’s gearing wouldn’t be a issue

 

[GATORB8]

That was where my initial confusion on the subject came up. A LJ is very close to a XJ as far as weight and wheelbase goes. Same motor ( talking about XJ’s with the tow package ) really the big differences are transmission as the XJ’s tow package used a aw4 with a cooler and rear suspension leafs vs coils. Other than that what could realistically be limiting a LJ?

TJ’s and XJ’s shared front suspension and if you had 3:73’s or even better a rubi with 4:10’s gearing wouldn’t be a issue

The trans and cooler can be a real difference maker in the SAE tests.

I personally think the most likely is that in order to improve ride quality (and potentially off road capability), Jeep limited the payload of the TJ to allow use of lighter springs. They determined better ride quality/off road was more important to the buying customer than sacrificing those to increase towing capacity.

You see a similar customer decision everyday on the roads. You'll see a lot more 3/4 tons than 1 tons despite the difference in price being low (less than $2k) for a significant increase in towing/hauling. It's because you have to really need the additional capacity to put up with the decrease in ride quality. Depending on state, there are some registration cost differences due to the GVWR that do effect that some.

 

[John Cooper]

Then you have this package for the JT.

The Jeep Gladiator Max Tow Package (available on Sport and Sport S trims) boosts towing to a maximum of 7,700 lbs by adding 4.10 axle gears, wider Dana 44 axles, a Trac-Lok limited-slip differential, and heavy-duty cooling. It is designed for maximum towing capacity, featuring essential hardware like a Class IV hitch, 240-amp alternator, and specific suspension upgrades.

 

[The Ontario jeeper]

The trans and cooler can be a real difference maker in the SAE tests.

I personally think the most likely is that in order to improve ride quality (and potentially off road capability), Jeep limited the payload of the TJ to allow use of lighter springs. They determined better ride quality/off road was more important to the buying customer than sacrificing those to increase towing capacity.

You see a similar customer decision everyday on the roads. You'll see a lot more 3/4 tons than 1 tons despite the difference in price being low (less than $2k) for a significant increase in towing/hauling. It's because you have to really need the additional capacity to put up with the decrease in ride quality. Depending on state, there are some registration cost differences due to the GVWR that do effect that some.

That is very true, trucks with a high payload capacity ride like dog poo when empty so I can see the rear springs playing a huge role in this too.