Winch plates, tow hooks, and bumpers

[Jerry Bransford]

I wouldn't classify those pictures as "daily driver" conditions.

A Jeep can be a daily driver and still wheel trails like that or even significantly more difficult. My TJ was a daily driver and it regularly did trails like that and tougher, it did rock crawling in Johnson Valley when it was a daily driver. A Jeep doesn't require stock or full-width bumpers to be a daily driver. A shopping cart is not one of my fears and if I had an accident with another car, a full-width bumper isn't going to make a significant difference.

 

[Goatman]

A Jeep can be a daily driver and still wheel trails like that or even significantly more difficult. My TJ was a daily driver and it regularly did trails like that and tougher, it did rock crawling in Johnson Valley when it was a daily driver. A Jeep doesn't require stock or full-width bumpers to be a daily driver. A shopping cart is not one of my fears and if I had an accident with another car, a full-width bumper isn't going to make a significant difference.

Ok. Being on the east coast means never seeing a trail like what you have for a driveway. All I am saying (which I think I did in my first post) is that if you need a stubby for approach and articulation purposes, then a DD would be better served with a full width bumper. Any time you remove a piece of safety equipment, granted a stock front bumper barely qualifies as such, then the opportunity for more damage rises. That is why every on road vehicle is sold with a full width bumper. And in my area you are far more likely to be in a tight tree lined trail than climbing boulders in an open area. Making a full bumper a better choice.

 

[jjvw]

What is the purpose of a full width bumper on pavement? I thought it was mostly for pedestrian safety, which is one of the reasons the stock bumpers can be as light as they are. Crumple zones likely were also a consideration, but we disrupt that design and engineering the moment we change the stock configuration.

As far as trees and a full width bumper is concerned, trees get in the way just as well as rocks do. Not having a piece of bumper (and body) there in the first place is always going to be the best option. And I suspect the tree prefers to be bumped by a rubber tire than a hard hunk of steel.

 

[Goatman]

rebuild able. The preferences of the trees is unknown to me, I am confident my Jeep would prefer the tree to hit the bumper rather than the fender. Here in my area trees grow straight up for the most part. So having a bumper helps protect the fender. And, at least on my Jeep, the fender covers the tire, so that straight growing tree would hit the fender before the tire gets to it. I saw that my last post seemed to be missing a few key words in it and that may be the cause of some miscomunication. I shall blame that on autocorrect instead of a lack of hand-eye-brain coordination.

 

[jjvw]

Whether it is a tree or a rock the Jeep is coming into contact with, one must make a decision about that interaction. A big bumper will protect the sheet metal, but can get in the way of forward progress while performing it's function of protecting the fenders. A smaller bumper will allow greater forward progress, while exposing the fenders to damage. A smaller bumper and smaller fenders will allow for greater forward progress and will reduce the chance of a damage to that smaller fender.

I don't see the differences in considerations between rocks and trees. A compromise always exists. And the compromise of a large protective bumper isn't a problem until it becomes a problem.

Though the considerations of weight are always present, regardless of where the Jeep is driven.

 

[pagrey]

Anybody concerned about strength of the wings or section that extends beyond the frame rails should go dirtworx. There is a pretty big difference between the strength of a folded c-channel and box steel.

 

[Goatman]

Let's agree to disagree. There are always pluses and minuses to any choice. I think we have both explained our preferences quite thoroughly. Either way is a reasonable choice and I think even the OP has given up listening to us at this point.
That is part of the beauty of a Jeep. It can be built in hundreds of various configurations to suit it owner best. Cheers!

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Anybody got a list of weights for these bumpers? I'm down to Savvy vs Warn stubby and would be interested in that info.

My guess is that my Body Armor bumper is heavier than both being that it's fully boxed, full length with a winch guard hoop, hitch receiver and another run of tube under that. I'd like to lighten up a bit.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

Savvy's is aluminum, it'd be lighter than Warn's steel bumper. I love my Savvy front bumper.

 

[pagrey]

My guess is that my Body Armor bumper is heavier than both being that it's fully boxed, full length with a winch guard hoop, hitch receiver and another run of tube under that. I'd like to lighten up a bit.

I run Body Armor bumpers, there isn't really anything else that weighs as much. It easily weighs twice any of the bumpers mentioned on this thread. They make one with an additional hoop that protects the hood and it is even more absurdly heavy. There is probably no other bumper as heavy, at least none I've seen. The rear bumper has large sections that are made of 3/8" steel plate. The front is probably similar. You could probably shed 50lbs with any of these. Be prepared to change front springs.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

Savvy's is aluminum, it'd be lighter than Warn's steel bumper. I love my Savvy front bumper.

Yeah, and it looks really well made. Just curious how much difference the material makes. By the time they're similarly equipped the price difference is about $100 and the Savvy will still need paint. Ten pounds isn't worth that much for me. 30 lbs might be.

 

[pagrey]

Shipping weight on the Warn is 43lbs.
Savvy says theirs weighs 30lbs.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

I run Body Armor bumpers, there isn't really anything else that weighs as much. It easily weighs twice any of the bumpers mentioned on this thread. They make one with an additional hoop that protects the hood and it is even more absurdly heavy. There is probably no other bumper as heavy, at least none I've seen. The rear bumper has large sections that are made of 3/8" steel plate. The front is probably similar. You could probably shed 50lbs with any of these. Be prepared to change front springs.

That's what I figured. They look heavy as hell. I broke a mounting bolt off in the rear passenger side because some A hole had cross threaded it prior to my ownership, so I want to change that one out for peace of mind, too. And I'm just not a fan of all the stuff going on with the extra hoops and the separate, raised winch mount. The winch covers dang near the entire grill.

Getting more lift out of the springs is most of the point. I don't know who made them or what they're supposed to be but right now it sits about 2.5-2.75" over stock. I intend to revamp my suspension next year with 4" Currie springs and rs5000x shocks of appropriate length anyway.

 

[jjvw]

Yeah, and it looks really well made. Just curious how much difference the material makes. By the time they're similarly equipped the price difference is about $100 and the Savvy will still need paint. Ten pounds isn't worth that much for me. 30 lbs might be.

There is more going on with the Savvy than just a weight savings.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

There is more going on with the Savvy than just a weight savings.

It's my primary driver for changing bumpers, but I'm all ears. Or eyes, as it were.

 

[pagrey]

There is more going on with the Savvy than just a weight savings.

Whatever is going on at Savvy I don't care, UCF makes the same thing for $100 less and Matt actually answers your questions and ships his products.

 

[jjvw]

I'm all ears. Or eyes, as it were.

Start by counting the frame attachment points. Savvy connects to the old sway bar mounting holes. This allows the deck to be larger which adds a lot of strength to the frame by becoming a large gusset. The winch itself can be moved further back on the deck, which looks nice. And the underside of the bumper is braced against the crossmember tube adding a tremendous amount of rigidity to the bumper.

 

[jjvw]

Whatever is going on at Savvy I don't care, UCF makes the same thing for $100 less and Matt actually answers your questions and ships his products.

Is UCF the same as what I just described?

-edit-
I just looked. They are not the same bumper. Not at all.

Good to hear that Matt answers your questions and ships his products. That doesn't change what his less expensive bumper is.

 

[pagrey]

Is UCF the same as what I just described?

-edit-
I just looked. They are not the same bumper. Not at all.

Good to hear that Matt answers your questions and ships his products. That doesn't change what his less expensive bumper is.

You're right, it is quite different. Well under 20lbs so there isn't much there. The do look a bit alike.

 

[jjvw]

You're right, it is quite different. Well under 20lbs so there isn't much there. The do look a bit alike.

The stubby bumper in my pic earlier in this thread looks very much like a MotoBilt stubby. But after a great amount of effort it is about as similar as Savvy is to UCF. Most of what makes it different is not readily seen.