05 Flame Red TJ Build
- Thread starter JMT
- Start date
Thanks for that
Technically it is more expensive when you add the air compressor, but there are several options for air. When I said the ARB was cheaper I meant the actual locker itself. It is true that when you buy an ARB it does not come with the air compressor. But if you already have onboard air you can adapt it to work.
Plus I don't want you to think I am talking down about the Elocker. I just think as a product ARB is nicer to the customer. The Elocker may be every bit as good as the ARB. I will let you know because soon I will have had both.
Alright guys! I am all in. I just ordered the front Elocker and gears and master kit. I talked to Allen today, and he is pretty awesome! Parts are on the way!
so @JMT I am hoping your guys shows up the next weekend because I plan on being busy at the same time!
so @JMT I am hoping your guys shows up the next weekend because I plan on being busy at the same time!
OP
That's good news brah! I'll let you know what the guy says this weekend. He should know soon whether he can make it up for the install!
OP
. I don't think it's going to happen. He responded to my texts about coming up the 21 or 22, but ultimately he didn't say he could come. I'm at a bit of a loss there, so I'm planning to go ahead with the front locker, install that in the carrier and go wheel it this Saturday. If I can't get him to come up I'll have to pay someone to put the gears in early next year or give it a shot myself. If I can get a pinion setup bearing, an extra crush sleeve, an inch-lb torque wrench, a pinion nut removal tool and a backlash indicator, I think I can do it.
A pinion nut removal tool? A socket?
Alright, I think my stuff showed up last night but I was too busy to look to see what showed up. If it is all there I am going for it this weekend.
You don't need an extra crush sleeve to get started worse comes to worse if you blow the crush sleeve, you can run and get a new one. You probably wont blow it because it is your first one and you will be meticulous. Plus I imagine you are going to have to do it by hand. Which means you are going to have to do it slow because it is so hard. so you can keep stopping and checking.
Honestly I have never blown a crush sleeve before except once when I used an air wrench to crush it. It works like this. it is really really really hard to crush but once it starts it gets super easy, so it is pretty easy to crush it to much, but if you do it by hand you will feel the transition. Once it transitions go really slow and keep checking it.
If you want to attempt it yourself this weekend regardless of the guy shows up, I will be around if you have any questions. I think you can rent all of those tools.
I wish I knew enough to help.
I know how it's done, just never done one myself or I would jump in and help.
I do know that you will need a 1/2 inch breaker bar with a cheater bar pipe to help with leverage, .. that way you have more control over the amount you crush that sleeve.
Yeah I call a pinion nut removal tool the same as a big o breaker bar with a big o cheater bar.
I know how it's done, just never done one myself or I would jump in and help.
I do know that you will need a 1/2 inch breaker bar with a cheater bar pipe to help with leverage, .. that way you have more control over the amount you crush that sleeve.
Yeah I call a pinion nut removal tool the same as a big o breaker bar with a big o cheater bar.
Even never doing one before, just having another set of eyes might be helpful.
I saw a video, and I will see if I can find it again where basically the guy got a pretty big pipe wrench, and put it on the yoke and rested the other side on the control arm then used the floor jack to push up on the breaker bar. It seemed pretty slick because it would only turn as much as the jack would pump in one pump at a time. I think I am going to try that when I do mine. I was thinking about converting to a high pinion because they don't have crush sleeves, but I have already ordered my parts, so we are doing this.
OP
If I knew I had more time, I would have searched for a high pinion too. Oh well.
I've looked at several solutions to removing the pinion nut. Most frown on using a pipe wrench, but I could give it a shot. I do have a 1 1/8" socket that fits the pinion nut. One issue is the Dana 44 is sitting on the bench, so there are no control arms or other solid points I can anchor the yoke. Maybe I can screw a 2x4 into the workbench. I'll think about it. I've got 1/2" brake bar and 4' cheaters, so I'm good there. Oh, and I'll need a race driver. I think AutoZone has one I can rent. They didn't have the inch-pound torque wrench or the backlash dial. I live in a small town. Blah on finding stuff.
I think you would be ok buying a race driver set it also doubles as a seal driving set and you will probably use it more than once. Might be ok to invest in that if you can afford it. I thing they are relatively cheap.
I am not sure what a pinion nut remover is, but I don't think you understood my description. I mean use the pipe wrench on the yoke to hold the pinion while you use the breaker bar and socket to crush the sleeve. I can't think of anything you need special for the nut and pinion except maybe a plastic or brass hammer.
The only specialty tools I have ever used that I can think of although it has been many years now was a dial indicator for backlash, an inch pound gauge for pinion preload and a micrometer for shimming the carrier. I didn't even have to use a press. If you are careful, you can use a die grinder to cut the bearings off of the pinion and carrier because you are replacing them anyway then grab the shims. I use a block of wood and a hammer and big sockets or tubing to pound the bearings back on. I do use some hyperlube on the bearings for a smoother install. I am going to be lucky on my Dana 30 install because I am changing the carrier and shimming on the outside rather than the inside so I won't have to cut the bearings off of my carrier unless I want to dig the original shims out as a starting point to shim, but I may or may not do that. It really means a couple of less tries of putting in and pulling out the carrier, unless I guess right the very first time.
Crushing the sleeve on the bench is going to be a challenge for sure. They do make a yoke tool you can bolt on to the yoke that has a slot for a jack handle. That might be worth looking into.
OP
I planned to install my PowerTrax NonSlip in the Dana 30 tomorrow. So I went out in the garage tonight to prep things.
Jacked her up, removed the tires, removed the diff cover, drained the fluid, pulled the axles 3-4” on each side (you need a 12pt 13mm for this), loosened the carrier bearing caps and got a big you know what to pry the carrier loose.
After about 10 minutes I found a good bar and spot and it came pretty easy. Removed the carrier bearing caps and put them safely where they need to be so I can put them back exactly as they were.
Got the carrier on the bench.
Time to remove the spider gears. You have to remove the ring gear to do this. Best to put it back in the same orientation, so mark the ring gear and carrier.
Pull the retaining pin and the spider gears almost fall out.
Get the thrust washers out too, you don’t need them with the NoSlip.
Ready to install the No Slip. It’s easy once you grasp the concept, but it has to be done perfect. Here’s what it looks like with the coupler, slip and driver with teeth locked.
Grease helps it all stay together while you put the retaining pin back in. Make sure those springs stay put! The kit comes with a small metal block that should slip in on the narrow edge and not slip in on the wide edge. Tolerances are pretty tight. I was dead on, so it looks good.
I’ll button things up in the morning. Gear fluid looked good, ring and pinion looked good. I’m hoping to give this thing a workout on Saturday! Thanks for watching...
Jacked her up, removed the tires, removed the diff cover, drained the fluid, pulled the axles 3-4” on each side (you need a 12pt 13mm for this), loosened the carrier bearing caps and got a big you know what to pry the carrier loose.
After about 10 minutes I found a good bar and spot and it came pretty easy. Removed the carrier bearing caps and put them safely where they need to be so I can put them back exactly as they were.
Got the carrier on the bench.
Time to remove the spider gears. You have to remove the ring gear to do this. Best to put it back in the same orientation, so mark the ring gear and carrier.
Pull the retaining pin and the spider gears almost fall out.
Get the thrust washers out too, you don’t need them with the NoSlip.
Ready to install the No Slip. It’s easy once you grasp the concept, but it has to be done perfect. Here’s what it looks like with the coupler, slip and driver with teeth locked.
Grease helps it all stay together while you put the retaining pin back in. Make sure those springs stay put! The kit comes with a small metal block that should slip in on the narrow edge and not slip in on the wide edge. Tolerances are pretty tight. I was dead on, so it looks good.
I’ll button things up in the morning. Gear fluid looked good, ring and pinion looked good. I’m hoping to give this thing a workout on Saturday! Thanks for watching...
Did you have to remove the carrier? I thought you can do a lunch box locker without removing the carrier another reason why they are popular. Nice job though for having the guts to go for it. Do you feel better about doing your gears now that you have done a half of one already?
OP
Yeah, I had to remove it. The pin would not come out without hitting the ring gear. So not only did I have to remove the carrier, but the ring gear too. If I had 3.07 gears I could have done it in the diff, but with 3.73’s you can’t. I do feel better about giving the gears a shot. I know there is more, but a little patience goes a long way. I’m going to start gathering the the tools I’ll need and read some more. It’s starting to make sense. I have no way to wallow out an old bearing to make a setup bearing, so I may have to bite the bullet and buy a pre-made one. Ultimately I see another TJ in the family sometime in the future, so knowing how to regear and having the tools might pay off!
derekmac
TJ Addict
OP
Are y’all ready for something that totally sucks?
So I go to button things up, get the carrier in, no problemo. Carrier bearing caps in the right way. Axles back in, bingo. Then I get back to the diff and all the banging from the axles knocked an inner spring out. Not good because I’ll be banging around a lot more than that just driving around. So I try to put it back in and it’s literally too short. I use my check block to double check my tolerances, which was really more like the 10th time I checked them. They were dead on. So I measure the spring and I call the company who makes these lockers. Turns out it’s master trucks or something like that. The tech answered. I tell him what’s going on and I say, “what’s the spec on the length of the spring?“ He tells me it’s .810. I say what is that in inches? I measured it and it was five eights of an inch. He said I don’t know. So I tell him, well I checked my tolerances and they’re perfect so you need to send me another spring, this one is too short. This is my daily driver. He says, OK. I said I need this tomorrow, when can you get it here? He says I don’t know, I’ll have to talk to the people who do that. I said why don’t you let me talk to those people? He said I’ll talk to them. So I hang up the phone and of course I call right back trying to get hold of that person but every extension it was just him. So about 20 minutes later he calls back. He says, yeah that’s not right. 810 is the spec and years or .625, which I knew by then, I went to school, but double check by pulling the other spring and checking them side-by-side. Which I was going to do anyway, but I knew it was never going to work, but I did anyway and here’s the results.
That dog won’t hunt. So now here I am waiting and hoping I will get a spring tomorrow. Asked about local auto parts stores having something like this and he said no, it’s a special part. So, I’m not counting my chickens until they hatch. This is very inconvenient but I’m trying to exercise patience this time. But I’m basically stranded.
So I go to button things up, get the carrier in, no problemo. Carrier bearing caps in the right way. Axles back in, bingo. Then I get back to the diff and all the banging from the axles knocked an inner spring out. Not good because I’ll be banging around a lot more than that just driving around. So I try to put it back in and it’s literally too short. I use my check block to double check my tolerances, which was really more like the 10th time I checked them. They were dead on. So I measure the spring and I call the company who makes these lockers. Turns out it’s master trucks or something like that. The tech answered. I tell him what’s going on and I say, “what’s the spec on the length of the spring?“ He tells me it’s .810. I say what is that in inches? I measured it and it was five eights of an inch. He said I don’t know. So I tell him, well I checked my tolerances and they’re perfect so you need to send me another spring, this one is too short. This is my daily driver. He says, OK. I said I need this tomorrow, when can you get it here? He says I don’t know, I’ll have to talk to the people who do that. I said why don’t you let me talk to those people? He said I’ll talk to them. So I hang up the phone and of course I call right back trying to get hold of that person but every extension it was just him. So about 20 minutes later he calls back. He says, yeah that’s not right. 810 is the spec and years or .625, which I knew by then, I went to school, but double check by pulling the other spring and checking them side-by-side. Which I was going to do anyway, but I knew it was never going to work, but I did anyway and here’s the results.
That dog won’t hunt. So now here I am waiting and hoping I will get a spring tomorrow. Asked about local auto parts stores having something like this and he said no, it’s a special part. So, I’m not counting my chickens until they hatch. This is very inconvenient but I’m trying to exercise patience this time. But I’m basically stranded.