2004 LJ In Flux

[Fluxor]

Also went camping, super fun and the temps dipped into the low 20s. For Florida it was cold and a nice change.

Feet got a little cold, still need to figure out how to make the hammock set up a tad warmer with out getting too heavy.

 

[NashvilleTJ]

As stated in the first-ish post I know my steering geo could be better. The bump steer was not bad but could improve so why not. My drag link was about 3” longer then my track bar. The next time I will cut off the factory track bar mount, make a frame side bracket and track bar.

just made a few .25” tabs and welded them to the tie rod. All my links are straight so there is no “roll” to any links, I have low mis alignment spacers on the tie rod and tie rod side of the drag link.

Works better, less bump steer is a good thing! I do NOT recommend this style steering on a tj front axle.


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I can‘t comment on whether or not that’s a good idea (but truthfully is does not look good), but regardless it looks like you made the bracket on the tie rod much too tall. The drag link and the track bar need to be parallel to avoid bump steer. In the picture from the front it is hard to see the frame side track bar mount, but they appear to be way off.

Again, hard to tell by the pics, but it looks like you need to lower the mount on the tie rod. But, I could be misreading the picture.

 

[Fluxor]

Parallel is best but less of an issue then equal length. They both make a circle and the less the circles deviate from each other the better. This is of course with in reason.

For datas sake I will cut the bracket off and lower it, I can make it parallel with the track bar I was just squeezing a little more down travel out of it.

I will report back and see if there is any improvement. Drives well but better is better.

Thanks.

 

[NashvilleTJ]

Parallel is best but less of an issue then equal length. They both make a circle and the less the circles deviate from each other the better. This is of course with in reason.

For datas sake I will cut the bracket off and lower it, I can make it parallel with the track bar I was just squeezing a little more down travel out of it.

I will report back and see if there is any improvement. Drives well but better is better.

Thanks.

That’s not correct at all. Ideally, parallel and equal length are what you strive for, but if they are not parallel you will always get bump steer. You can get by without equal length, within reason. It’s just the way the track bar / drag link interact as the suspension moves.

And didn’t you say you were still getting bump steer in this configuration? That is why.

Moving the mount lower will not impact your droop at all.

 

[Fluxor]

Ok, wouldn’t be the first thing I misunderstood. I always thought the opposite. I put a straight edge on my track bar bolts. I’m all about learning better ways!

 

[Fluxor]

I’m at 6 degrees on my track bar
and 4.1 on my drag link. Can’t get a good picture of the track bar angle.

 

[NashvilleTJ]

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Ok, wouldn’t be the first thing I misunderstood. I always thought the opposite. I put a straight edge on my track bar bolts. I’m all about learning better ways!

You got it - see how much different the angle is between the two? That’s what causes bump steer.

When the front suspension compresses, the track bar causes the axle to move to the passenger side. When this happens, to avoid turning the wheels the drag link connection at the wheel side must also move the same distance as the axle. In order for this to happen the axle sides of the track bar and drag link must move in the same arc. The only way that can happen is if they are parallel to each other - and close to the same length.

 

[Fluxor]

Truth is the amount of down travel does not out

way having them perfect. That what I get for doing stuff in the middle of the night lol!

 

[NashvilleTJ]

I’m at 6 degrees on my track bar
and 4.1 on my drag link. Can’t get a good picture of the track bar angle.View attachment 306739

That difference will definitely cause bump steer. Likely pretty bad. It does not take much difference at all to turn the wheels enough to notice.

I still don’t like the connection to the tie rod, because I think it will roll the tie rod, but at least the geometry will be better.

 

[Fluxor]

Round 3, when am I going to learn to slow down and do things once. Moved it about an inch down and now both are with in .2 degrees of each other.

 

[Fluxor]

I’m running low mis alignment spacers on that connection and when I have a friend move the steering wheel there is no roll or bind, all the links are really in line with each other.
Actually the only high mis alignment spacer is on the pitman arm.

I agree and this was definitely something I checked after round two. But we shall see!

 

[Fluxor]

Just took it for a quick test run and didn’t notice much until I hit some of larger dips in the road and the good old rail road track at 40 test. That’s when I noticed more stability. So now I’m within an 1/8” in length and .2 in angle. Thanks for the input Nashville it was super helpfull!

 

[Fluxor]

The position of the backup lights in The bumper I made fell short in two areas. First the angle was too much, they pointed towards the ground and not straight back. Second the face they are on made them vulnerable and would most likely get smashed sooner or later. I cut the lens and mounted them in the tail light housing.

This location works great, after seeing it I think I’m going to make a aluminum housing that uses a aftermarket backup light and a led tail/brake/turn signal for a cleaner and more durable housing light combo.

 

[Fluxor]

Needs black button head screws.

You know your old when well positioned back up lights make you happy! Lol

 

[Fluxor]

I'm working on some Corner and Rocker Guards and would like some opinions. I like the Savvy stuff and know its a fan favorite as it should be. I like building parts so buying is not an option. Shipping to the east coast along with crazy lead times on parts has myself along with a few friends wanting our own supply chain.

I have friend working on the large radius Die for the corner guards.

Corner Guards are set for 6061 Aluminum. I am more concerned and interest in mounting options. Hole location etc. I want stock wheel opening with no factory flare holes. The next set will be fit for enlarged wheel opening and then stretched. Stock fuel door opening that is not shown in CAD and stock tail lights. I have some other ideas (low profile bolt on steel flares, Rub rail etc.) but want to start with the basics. I am also leaning towards counter sunk hardware, it looks so much cleaner when installed in my opinion.

Next are the Rocker Guards. I am thinking Aluminum base plate with a steel outer structure that take most of the abuse. The bend in the Aluminum is tighter and will be annealed before bending. the outer structure bolts to the base plate and will bolt to the torque box and or channel running under the floor. Mounting only to the body no frame connections of any kind.

Do you think I need to add material back to the center of the aluminum plate, eliminate the bend, add a bend to the outer plate and sandwich everything?

Option one: Sharper edge. I have internal gussets,

Option two. Same idea but with a squared off outer shape.

 

[Mike_H]

I'm working on some Corner and Rocker Guards and would like some opinions. I like the Savvy stuff and know its a fan favorite as it should be. I like building parts so buying is not an option. Shipping to the east coast along with crazy lead times on parts has myself along with a few friends wanting our own supply chain.

I have friend working on the large radius Die for the corner guards.

Corner Guards are set for 6061 Aluminum. I am more concerned and interest in mounting options. Hole location etc. I want stock wheel opening with no factory flare holes. The next set will be fit for enlarged wheel opening and then stretched. Stock fuel door opening that is not shown in CAD and stock tail lights. I have some other ideas (low profile bolt on steel flares, Rub rail etc.) but want to start with the basics. I am also leaning towards counter sunk hardware, it looks so much cleaner when installed in my opinion.
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Next are the Rocker Guards. I am thinking Aluminum base plate with a steel outer structure that take most of the abuse. The bend in the Aluminum is tighter and will be annealed before bending. the outer structure bolts to the base plate and will bolt to the torque box and or channel running under the floor. Mounting only to the body no frame connections of any kind.

Do you think I need to add material back to the center of the aluminum plate, eliminate the bend, add a bend to the outer plate and sandwich everything?

Option one: Sharper edge. I have internal gussets,
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Option two. Same idea but with a squared off outer shape.
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In my opinion, the aluminum should wrap the tub and the slider rail should attach to it. You have it designed very similarly to JCR crusader sliders.

 

[Fluxor]

Finally getting back to the rocker guards. I had a transmission issue that went on forever. I have to thank Wranglerfix for the TCM as that ended up being the issue.

I agree with you @Mike_H this design might be ok if all steel and not used super hard. I changed the rocker to a full aluminum base plate with a steel outer skin I debated between 1/8" and 3/16" for the outer skid and landed on 3/16". The 1/8" seems fine for just a rash guard but I want to weld tubes for roof rack steps and to keep the body a little further away from damage. So I made some changes.

 

[Fluxor]

The Base plate will be 6061-T6 with the large radius bends, one small bend or "kink" at the door sill to help keep gaps to a minimum and two bends and wheel to wheel. The outer skin is P.O. .1875 with matching bends. Tubing is 1/34 .120 wall with pretty simple bends and miters. I have a friend that wants a version with .125 outer skid plate and NO tube. I am interested how well that would hold up to abuse, seems with the aluminum backer the plate cant move very far and will do fine. I love how Savvy rockers fit and work but I changed where the fasteners go on the bottom side and changed the outer skid plate design. I think the savvy kit is perfection with stock fenders. I am not running stock fenders and wanted a different look. All input is appreciated. Thanks!

 

[PNW_LJ]

The Base plate will be 6061-T6 with the large radius bends, one small bend or "kink" at the door sill to help keep gaps to a minimum and two bends and wheel to wheel. The outer skin is P.O. .1875 with matching bends. Tubing is 1/34 .120 wall with pretty simple bends and miters. I have a friend that wants a version with .125 outer skid plate and NO tube. I am interested how well that would hold up to abuse, seems with the aluminum backer the plate cant move very far and will do fine. I love how Savvy rockers fit and wok but I changed where the fasteners go on the bottom side and changed the outer skid plate design. I think the savvy kit is perfection with stock fenders. I am not running stock fenders and wanted a different look. All input is appreciated. Thanks!

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One consideration is to make the angle of the tube and the bottom edge of the backer portion, match each other. This is something that even the GR mini-boatsides get wrong.

 

[Fluxor]

One consideration is to make the angle of the tube and the bottom edge of the backer portion, match each other. This is something that even the GR mini-boatsides get wrong.

Good point, I think its pretty close but I'll check.