Looking for 4.6 stroker engine feedback

[macleanflood]

Can't wait for someone with a 5 axis mill to make billet 4.0 blocks with sleeved pistons.

-Mac

 

[SkylinesSuck]

Can't wait for someone with a 5 axis mill to make billet 4.0 blocks with sleeved pistons.

-Mac

And provisions for a roller cam *cough* @Jezza *cough*

 

[NashvilleTJ]

Jezza likely knows a good amount about this topic. I believe he said something about a 300hp build being a good balance for power and reliability. He would know since he's been pushing things I haven't seen others push things.

Also, if you make a legit boosted stroker, you then need to address the transmission. The second I think about this, it reminds me to leave things alone...whether that's a stroker or a boosted 4.0L.

Turbos also scare people off due to the belief that it will make the engine unreliable, so I understand where you are coming from.



Over the winter, I read that currently offered lifters are pretty much all made in the same place these days. Not sure if it's true, but it wouldn't surprise me. Reviews aren't great on any of the brands RA carries.



I would have gone with the smaller cam as well if it meant my build would be more reliable. Is that why you went smaller? I assume that his disappointment was based on him thinking that if you go with a smaller cam, then why do some of the other stuff you chose.



My EGTs stay in a nice range, so I'll likely sell the gauge when I install the slate gray interior.

Most of what I read stated that cooler EGTs mean slower flowing gasses for spooling up the turbo. Many guys wrap their exhausts to keep the heat in so things will flow faster. I wrapped things to lower the under hood temps for IATs more than to help the gasses flow faster, but flow is no problem since the piping goes from from 2.5" to 3" after the downpipe.

I'm not disappointed in my power and don't seem to have problematic heat issues. For that reason, I likely won't change things when I'm happy with the power and reliability of this package.

Years ago now, there was member who built a stroker to pair with his Banks Turbo...and ported things to add more flow. He later mocked himself for thinking he knew more than Gale Banks because Banks said their kit was built for a stock motor. He said that his stroker didn't perform well with the turbo, and he sold the turbo since he had just dropped $$$$ on the stroker. Bummer all the way around except for the member who now runs his turbo in the NE.

We know Jezza is running his turbo with a stroker. I haven't directly asked him if he'd suggest doing a turbo, stroker, or turbo'd stroker. That said, I wouldn't trust the 42RLE to stay happy with a turbo'd stroker. Would a manual hold up better?

My personal experience with the 42’ was exactly that. When I ran the supercharger on the old I6 (I know, I know - can’t directly compare the SC to your sissy turbos ) (Edit: for anyone that does not know me, yes I am kidding). But likely similar output to what you guys are getting - around 300 ponies and 400 torques at the crank.

Even on a very low mileage 42’ - something like 5k miles? - it did not take much running behind the SC before the tranny started showing signs of slipping. I had it rebuilt and beefed up by ATS and never had a problem after that. But, it was pricey. I also run an ATS behind the Hemi, and it works very well.

 

[Rickyd]

Dang, sorry to hear about the engine going down. How did you get mud in there?

I bought it from a kid who sunk it in a pond. These really are tough motors! There was mud in everything.gas tank,transmission,and i still drove it 4 hrs home...

 

[Rickyd]

And provisions for roller rockers *cough* @Jezza *cough*

Roller cam you mean?

 

[williambmac]

Roller cam you mean?

There was talk on jeepstrokers a few years ago about research into a hydraulic roller retrofit kit. I think that 505 performance had one, but I wouldn't trust any of their stuff.
I used to have a wholesale account with Crower and I spoke to the rep there. I got the not enough interest and not profitable excuse.
I'm not sure if this is true or not but I was reading that the reason a lot of the aftermarket 4.0 cams fail is because the lobe is not wide enough.

 

[Jezza]

Most of the options for custom engine parts are far too expensive for the Jeep market. I priced a set of JE pistons a while back and they were almost $1500. A billet block would be $10k minimum and a hydraulic roller cam setup was going to be $1200 or so for the parts needed to make it work. Honestly at this point I would just do a lightly ported head with a stock cam and 1.7 ratio rockers.

 

[Rickyd]

There was talk on jeepstrokers a few years ago about research into a hydraulic roller retrofit kit. I think that 505 performance had one, but I wouldn't trust any of their stuff.
I used to have a wholesale account with Crower and I spoke to the rep there. I got the not enough interest and not profitable excuse.
I'm not sure if this is true or not but I was reading that the reason a lot of the aftermarket 4.0 cams fail is because the lobe is not wide enough.

Yeah,i wouldn't touch anything of 505's.
I just went out and measured a stock cam,5/8" wide lobe and roughly 1.25" casting thickness between lobes. I have heard the same thing about lobe thickness but also heard that it doesn't matter? I do know that the functioning stock cam i just measured has places that the wear pattern spreads out to the full width?

I've had and still have issues with lifters not holding prime. My nitrided cam is happy so far with a few lobes seating more than one new lifter?

I used russ's comp cam 68-231-4, 206/214 duration,.462"/.485" lift, custom ground 113* lsa for jeep fuel injection and nitrided. I think the larger russ 97-99 cam is a 68-235?(looks like SkylinesSuck has an even bigger one,the 235 is

• 210/218 Duration at .050". 111 Degree Lobe Separation Angle
• 0.477"/0.493" Valve Lift)

@SkylinesSuck is running this cam i believe?it sounds great. My cam card also said 68-000-x but it is really a 231 with 113 lsa

 

[Rickyd]

a hydraulic roller cam setup was going to be $1200 or so for the parts needed to make it work.

That isn't so bad if the setup worked? It would be fun to build a 6500rpm stroker

 

[BlueC]

That isn't so bad if the setup worked? It would be fun to build a 6500rpm stroker

If you have to have a hot rod I-6, I have the remedy, and it's boost ready and would probably be good for 10,000 RPM.

https://www.dartheads.com/product-category/blocks/toyota-2jz/

 

[Rickyd]

If you have to have a hot rod I-6, I have the remedy, and it's boost ready and would probably be good for 10,000 RPM.

View attachment 546091
https://www.dartheads.com/product-category/blocks/toyota-2jz/

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

 

[BlueC]

I do know that the functioning stock cam i just measured has places that the wear pattern spreads out to the full width?

A normal wear pattern should be a small line around the base, with an increase/taper to almost full width as the lifter rides up the lobe to the peak, then the pattern should reverse on the down slope. A higher spring pressure can take it to full width, and IDK if that's bad or not. If you're running full width significantly before the peak, like 1/2 way up/down the lobe, you have too much spring pressure. If you're riding full width on the base, you have other issues.

 

[BlueC]

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That sounds like a 2JZ. Whatever it is, that looks like a fun ride.

 

[Woodrow]

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definitely NOT a jeep 4.0 but oh so nice…

 

[NashvilleTJ]

That sounds like a 2JZ. Whatever it is, that looks like a fun ride.

Sounds just like Finnegan's Death Metal Charger.

 

[Rickyd]

A normal wear pattern should be a small line around the base, with an increase/taper to almost full width as the lifter rides up the lobe to the peak, then the pattern should reverse on the down slope. A higher spring pressure can take it to full width, and IDK if that's bad or not. If you're running full width significantly before the peak, like 1/2 way up/down the lobe, you have too much spring pressure. If you're riding full width on the base, you have other issues.

Thanks for the education there. The pattern did vary but i don't remember at what points. About 200k on that 4.0l cam.

That sounds like a 2JZ. Whatever it is, that looks like a fun ride.

That tj is in a couple different instagram feeds. Supposedly a 2jz?

You know,now that i think about it i bet you could use some combination of factory parts to bolt one to an aw4 or ax15

 

[Mike_H]

Can't wait for someone with a 5 axis mill to make billet 4.0 blocks with sleeved pistons.

-Mac

I have a 5-axis mill…there isn’t anywhere near enough people with the cash to burn for me to even think about that. A np205 based billet aluminum transfer case, on the other hand…

 

[SkylinesSuck]

Roller cam you mean?

Sì. I'm on vacay and not paying attention.

Most of the options for custom engine parts are far too expensive for the Jeep market. I priced a set of JE pistons a while back and they were almost $1500. A billet block would be $10k minimum and a hydraulic roller cam setup was going to be $1200 or so for the parts needed to make it work. Honestly at this point I would just do a lightly ported head with a stock cam and 1.7 ratio rockers.

Most people would not spend that kinda money on a 4.x so producing it likely wouldn't make sense. That being said, if you make one for $1500, I'll buy it tomorrow.

Yeah,i wouldn't touch anything of 505's.
I just went out and measured a stock cam,5/8" wide lobe and roughly 1.25" casting thickness between lobes. I have heard the same thing about lobe thickness but also heard that it doesn't matter? I do know that the functioning stock cam i just measured has places that the wear pattern spreads out to the full width?

I've had and still have issues with lifters not holding prime. My nitrided cam is happy so far with a few lobes seating more than one new lifter?

I used russ's comp cam 68-231-4, 206/214 duration,.462"/.485" lift, custom ground 113* lsa for jeep fuel injection and nitrided. I think the larger russ 97-99 cam is a 68-235?(looks like SkylinesSuck has an even bigger one,the 235 is

• 210/218 Duration at .050". 111 Degree Lobe Separation Angle
• 0.477"/0.493" Valve Lift)

@SkylinesSuck is running this cam i believe?it sounds great. My cam card also said 68-000-x but it is really a 231 with 113 lsa
View attachment 546090

Russ said this was the biggest off the shelf grind they had except he recommended the 113 lsa to improve idle and vacuum. I said F that, gimme dat chop. 111 lsa

A normal wear pattern should be a small line around the base, with an increase/taper to almost full width as the lifter rides up the lobe to the peak, then the pattern should reverse on the down slope. A higher spring pressure can take it to full width, and IDK if that's bad or not. If you're running full width significantly before the peak, like 1/2 way up/down the lobe, you have too much spring pressure. If you're riding full width on the base, you have other issues.

Interesting. I hadn't heard any of that before.

 

[SkylinesSuck]

That sounds like a 2JZ. Whatever it is, that looks like a fun ride.

Definitely sounds like a 2J.

 

[BlueC]

Interesting. I hadn't heard any of that before.

Keep in mind that is for a flat tappet. Width is related to load, i.e. spring pressure and ratio. Rollers and OHC will probably be different, but I'm not familiar enough with those to describe a normal pattern, but I'd assume it's similar.