A surprisingly inappropriate and disappointing response to my simple thank you.You need to get some new reading glasses old man....... Not that I have any room to talk..
Will a 32RH work well with 4.88 gears and 35s?
- Thread starter Eddie Greenlee
- Start date
Damn Jerry lighten UP...... It was a JOKE didn't you notice the laughing faces?
Rubicon88
TJ Addict
We aren't talking about 6-10 speed autos..although I've seat time with them..
The question was about an automatic 15 plus years old and a TJ platform.
I didn't just start wheeling and cut my teeth with a manual TJ.
Aside from fitment on certain trails I've wheeled the same shit no matter the vehicle. Given the amount of vehicles I've owned (embarrassing) you could say my experience traverses the rainbow
For the reasons I listed...driver control and reliability...yes I'll take the manual all day long and twice on Sunday's. And reliability...the verdict is still out on the newest of auto's from an endurance point of view. They still are as finicky as ever and with the addition of mucho grande electronics involved ...even more so today than ever before.
I've never once found myself thinking boy i wish this was an automatic in any of the manuals I've owned. Never once. I've certainly wished some of my auto's were manuals.
Certainly have wished some of my manuals were better...
Strength or gearing or both
Here's looking at you ,
ax-5 \
Sr4 ——— these 3 are shit
SMOD /
T4/T5
NSG370
Even with the above trannies I've owned and didn't love, I'd still rather have those than any Automatic.
The ones I've owned and loved were the
T18 \
Np435 ——— 3 indestructible
SM420 /
Short...ultra low gearing
I really like these..
ax-15, nv3550. Fairly solid with ok gearing. Go to trail, do trail, go home. Love that reliability.
The only right transmission is the one you want. We can opine all day long but if you as the driver want tranny X...go for it.
To each their own.
You and I go round and round on different subjects all the time. You claim an automatic doesn't do all of these things that a manual tranny does. And I disagree. Even a 15 year old 32RH has good compression breaking and you can control the gear you're in. And there are people putting the newer multi-gear auto trannies into TJ's behind newer power plants.
But as you said we all have our own ideas and like and dislikes. But I don't agree with some of your comments about what a auto tranny CAN'T so.
And as a side note NOTHING is indestructible not even the 3 trannies you listed.
Have a great new year and let's hope things start getting better.
Rubicon88
TJ Addict
Honestly I'm too busy to know or even think of whom I'm going round and round with, as you put it.
I didn't think any of this was a competition. If it is I'm certainly not scoreboard watching.
The OP asked me..as in ME..why I wouldn't trade a manual for an automatic. I answered why I would never do that. Of course that's MY opinion and nothing more.
I've owned many platforms in both a manual and auto.
I'd take the manual all day long.
You can dissect the compression braking all you want but don't kid yourself...it's still not a manual. Moreover I never said auto's don't have any engine braking which you seem to imply...but they just have less than a manual. That's without even getting into the brawn of the group with mid 6:1 first gears and even lower in reverse.
As I repeatedly stated there is no comparison in the reliability point. When you have significantly more parts to make it work that alone by default makes it less reliable. There's just more things that must be adequate to work right. You don't have such issues with a manual. Not even close.
As far as the three I mentioned being indestructible...
Well gee...if we got dynamite out we can obliterate anything. There are people breaking Dana 60's on a little Jeep. Yep anything can happen.
However it's much less likely
and without exaggeration there are 4 transmissions that I'd equate to indestructible if any driver has the slightest bit of sense.
T18
Np435
Sm420
Sm465
These are by far the strongest light truck transmissions ever used.
If you destroy one of those you're intentionally trying to or literally have zero sense with the machine.
As far as people doing conversions with this or that...well good for them.
There is also generations among us that have no idea how to drive a manual. Never learned or cared...but make no mistake they've no clue what to even do with a third pedal.
Combine that with ease of acquiring parts and you definitely would have a lopsided tally on what they're swapping. Just look at the Ram with a hemi. How many 5.7 ram trucks came with a stick versus an auto.
I'd say out of 10... 9-1 ratio with auto getting in 9 trucks to every 1 manual. You can't even get a regular Ram 1500 Hemi with a manual. It has to be a 2500+ which thins out the inventory even more.
The old school brute transmissions get ignored whether a bolt pattern, or lack of overdrive...which I find trendy and comical. They want a modified rig on it's best day gets 18mpg but drop in a 4 speed manual and it gets 16.5 mpg.
Oh my dear lord. So crippling.
As much as I love a nice manual trans, and in particular the smooth-shifting AX15, I think terrain and trails will dictate what is "best" for any one particular rig. This of course can easily be overshadowed by personal preference. As others have experienced, I too have went from being a diehard manual trans lover to someone who is actively swapping to an auto trans. The control through technical terrain is simply unmatched by even the best manual trans driver (to which I consider myself an experienced and skilled user).
From a reliability standpoint, while most auto's have far more parts and complexity internally, there is plenty of anecdotal evidence to suggest that they're sufficiently reliable and in particular the 32RH that has likely driven across every known trail in the US and much of North America. Ironically, I've seen more on-trail failures due to hydraulic master/slave issues on Jeeps than I have of any automatic trans failure.
The "more parts = worse" adage is dated and is as incorrect now as it was when it first popped up (I've spent over a decade managing QMS systems in the semiconductor industry, so I'm happy to discuss "quality" and "reliability" in as much depth as anyone would like). If this were true, we'd all be removing our EFI for a simple points-and-condenser setup.
From a reliability standpoint, while most auto's have far more parts and complexity internally, there is plenty of anecdotal evidence to suggest that they're sufficiently reliable and in particular the 32RH that has likely driven across every known trail in the US and much of North America. Ironically, I've seen more on-trail failures due to hydraulic master/slave issues on Jeeps than I have of any automatic trans failure.
The "more parts = worse" adage is dated and is as incorrect now as it was when it first popped up (I've spent over a decade managing QMS systems in the semiconductor industry, so I'm happy to discuss "quality" and "reliability" in as much depth as anyone would like). If this were true, we'd all be removing our EFI for a simple points-and-condenser setup.
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Very well said @pc1p and what's funny is that up until I'd gotten hurt you couldn't give be an auto tranny rig. I also find it interesting that @Rubicon88 thinks that these auto trannies are so inadequate compared to a manual tranny.
And yes I use to think ALOT of the same things about auto trannies until I started working on them and rebuilt a few. Once I learned how they REALLY work I found out they weren't as terrible as I'd thought. Then losing the use of my right foot made me swap to a auto tranny in my Jeep since I couldn't 3 foot it anymore. And I was pleasantly surprised as how well the auto did off-road. Now my TJ is built a little more but I was really amazed at how well it did compression braking. Up until that point I'd never really driven a auto off-road.
Eddie, I don't know for you how an auto will work but I would suggest if there is someone you know that owns a Jeep with a auto I'd see if I could swap rigs for a trail ride so you can see if you like it before doing the swap.
And yes I use to think ALOT of the same things about auto trannies until I started working on them and rebuilt a few. Once I learned how they REALLY work I found out they weren't as terrible as I'd thought. Then losing the use of my right foot made me swap to a auto tranny in my Jeep since I couldn't 3 foot it anymore. And I was pleasantly surprised as how well the auto did off-road. Now my TJ is built a little more but I was really amazed at how well it did compression braking. Up until that point I'd never really driven a auto off-road.
Eddie, I don't know for you how an auto will work but I would suggest if there is someone you know that owns a Jeep with a auto I'd see if I could swap rigs for a trail ride so you can see if you like it before doing the swap.
Rubicon88
TJ Addict
If this is interesting to you then might I suggest some paint drying for your viewing pleasure.
Do you find it interesting if drivers of any of the following
Challenger, mustang, Corvette, Jetta's, BMW's, Porsche, Camaro's, 370z's and so on and so on opt for the real manual over an auto?
They have a large enough manual following it makes complete business sense to still offer said platforms with a real deal manual.
Perhaps those drivers enjoy their vehicles in large array of driving roads and settings instead of just hold it to the floor for 1/4 mile and let off.
While they may still dabble in a 1/4 mile or 1/8 mile ET driving they also get some real road track time. Maybe they're just spirited drivers on some nice back roads they know and love. Down shifting into a corner and finding that right gear to power out of the corner.
Seems like they're seeking the most driver control of said machine.
I don't find that interesting whatsoever.
I do however find it fitting and proper that someone still has a choice to buy the transmission they so desire...especially if it helps meet their driving needs and makes them content.
I'm not sure who put up an efi to carb comparo in relation to a manual being more reliable or not.
That's not just out in left field but not even in the same ball park.
I work on this shit every damn day. I know all about the workings of both of these things. Some things I wished I never got good at. LoL
IMO...I don't want to worry about the TC, speed, heat, burning fluid, sucking air on a steep mile plus climb, the cooler and it's well being, etc etc.
Take fluid away from the auto and it won't work. Period. Not a maybe. It just won't. Puncture to the trans cooler or damaged line and guess what...your nose better be good and hope you caught it in time before you burn it up. Electronics...sensors...all have become integrated components of said automatic.
You obviously are perfectly ok with the above and good for you. Others are too. Again, good for them.
I, OTOH, prefer the simplicity of a good manual that allows me more control of the machine.
On a side note....
You borderline sound like your feelings are hurt about my comments on the automatic.
You've brought up more than once being incapable of driving if it wasn't for the automatic. Well good for you. I mean that with no sarcasm. A transmission that allowed you to continue driving since you couldn't drive a manual. That's great.
Outside of that I don't care what you drive and why.
I don't find it interesting nor boring. I just don't care.
Actually if you're getting into your rig and hitting the trail...that's all that matters. Too many people buy a jeep...build a jeep...then only drive it from the kitchen window staring at it in the driveway.
If you're making tracks then you're still in the game. That's all that matters to me.
Good day
@Rubicon88 do you EVER stop???? Yes we all get it .... You like a manual transmission and good for you we are all HAPPY for you. Now go put a manual transmission behind a Dodge Magnum V-8.....
And I think you are missing the major POINT here. In some types of terrain the automatic transmission excels. Hands down it just works better for some situations. Now in a sports car/street car/road race rig a manual or a paddle shift would be better. In no way am I saying a manual doesn't have it's place. Heck I'd hate to have to drive one of these new semis with automatic transmission as I don't think an auto will work as well as my brain in a semi. And it's just FUN to drive a sporty car with a manual transmission.
But for a lot of the different types of terrain our Jeep are used on many of us feel an auto tranny is better. You can keep on using your manual but as others have suggested you might change your mind if you wheeled some stuff out west. Not saying there isn't difficult trails out east just not the same.
You keep rockin your manual tranny & those of us who have autos with rock them.
Yep I have a restricted drivers license that I can only drive an auto. If I feel the need I can challenge this restriction by going and taking the drivers test again in a manual vehicle. But I don't see the need anymore. Ram doesn't offer a manual trans in their 1 ton and larger trucks with a diesel. 2018 was the last year and you had to get it with a reduced output because the transmissions couldn't handle the torque.
And I think you are missing the major POINT here. In some types of terrain the automatic transmission excels. Hands down it just works better for some situations. Now in a sports car/street car/road race rig a manual or a paddle shift would be better. In no way am I saying a manual doesn't have it's place. Heck I'd hate to have to drive one of these new semis with automatic transmission as I don't think an auto will work as well as my brain in a semi. And it's just FUN to drive a sporty car with a manual transmission.
But for a lot of the different types of terrain our Jeep are used on many of us feel an auto tranny is better. You can keep on using your manual but as others have suggested you might change your mind if you wheeled some stuff out west. Not saying there isn't difficult trails out east just not the same.
You keep rockin your manual tranny & those of us who have autos with rock them.
Yep I have a restricted drivers license that I can only drive an auto. If I feel the need I can challenge this restriction by going and taking the drivers test again in a manual vehicle. But I don't see the need anymore. Ram doesn't offer a manual trans in their 1 ton and larger trucks with a diesel. 2018 was the last year and you had to get it with a reduced output because the transmissions couldn't handle the torque.
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OP
In your opinion, would you try and find a “ really good 32RH transmission “ OR
A 32RH transmission you know will need rebuilding for $260.00, rebuild it and know what you have ???
A 32RH transmission you know will need rebuilding for $260.00, rebuild it and know what you have ???
Too many if's for me to answer that. How do you know it is "really good", was it from a buddy's TJ you know well or was it from someone you don't know who says it's "really good"? And $260 sounds too cheap to rebuild a 32RH unless you're doing it yourself and know what you're doing.
I think he meant the core he will be buying - and the one that will need rebuilding - will cost him $260 (just for the core)...
OP
I meant I can buy a 32RH right now for 250.00 but he said it had started to slip a little. So he figured it needed rebuilding.
I agree , someone telling me their 32RH is in great shape doesn’t hold much weight.
so buying one for cheap (250.00) and having it rebuilt , then you would know what you had .?
Yes that'd be a good thing knowing it was good after being rebuilt. But that he said it had started to slip a bit may also just mean it's low on ATF. I've been on the trail twice when someone indicated their 32RH was slipping and all that was wrong was that it was low on ATF. Bringing up to the full mark with ATF+4 fixed it.
$250 for a core is a good price. Out here a rebuild is over $2k for a 32rh. Labor rates arent cheap in southern california.
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