Rear Spring Relocation Without Adding Height?

[notnsuv]

Had measured front ride height with ACOS and 4.5" RE springs in place (19"). ACOS have been removed now so I'm re-installing springs with upper isolators, Bilstein shocks that were on it, and will install tires again and re-measure ride height, then take it all apart again to measure for shocks yet again. Is that a good procedure to be sure I'm getting shock length and bumps correct? Seems like the original ride height measurement of 19" isn't gonna do me any good going forward.

 

[jjvw]

Had measured front ride height with ACOS and 4.5" RE springs in place (19"). ACOS have been removed now so I'm re-installing springs with upper isolators, Bilstein shocks that were on it, and will install tires again and re-measure ride height, then take it all apart again to measure for shocks yet again. Is that a good procedure to be sure I'm getting shock length and bumps correct? Seems like the original ride height measurement of 19" isn't gonna do me any good going forward.

It doesn't hurt to run through the process again. Though, if you understand the measurements and the movements and that the shock's compressed and extended lengths don't change unless you change the shocks or the mounts, you can probably figure out what a change in ride height will do.

 

[notnsuv]

Swapping ends for a minute.
8.5" shaft at ride height rear. Almost 100% extended I'd guess. And by the dirt on the shaft never compress anywhere near full.

 

[LONGJP2]

And by the dirt on the shaft never compress anywhere near full.

I've got small plastic wire ties on my shock shafts. Easy way to check if I bottomed out the shock after a day on the trail. Or how much travel I'm actually using.
Hard to guarantee that the suspension was cycled into every conceivable position that might arise on the trail.

 

[notnsuv]

I've got small plastic wire ties on my shock shafts. Easy way to check if I bottomed out the shock after a day on the trail. Hard to guarantee that the suspension was cycled into every conceivable position that might arise on the trail.

I'll do the rear cycle when the front is done. I'll remember the zip tie thing when the time comes.
Waiting on new diff covers, tire/wheels, and trackbar.

I can cycle the front w/o the diff cover on so am in that process. Driver's side wont clear even the OEM cover and leaves 1.5" or more shock compression on the table.

I guess my concern with that picture was 90% shaft showing at ride height.

 

[jjvw]

Swapping ends for a minute.
8.5" shaft at ride height rear. Almost 100% extended I'd guess. And by the dirt on the shaft never compress anywhere near full.

View attachment 293466

You know what to do. Cycle the axle!

 

[notnsuv]

Yup, after the front.

 

[notnsuv]

Initial ride height of 4.5" RE front springs including ACOS
19"

Bilstein shocks
24.25" extended
14.25" full compression
10" shock?
7" shaft showing at ride height.
Doesn't that tell me I had 7" up, 3" down travel?/ Hardly 50/50

Removed ACOS and put the springs, shocks and tire/wheels back on. Trackbar disconnected at the axle, Anti-Rock disco also.
New ride height 17".
Driver 4.75" shaft exposed
Passenger 5" shaft exposed
Very close to 50/50 on 10" shock, correct?

My conclusion is that the Bilstein shocks are the correct length for 4.5" lift (RE springs) without the ACOS in place at 2" added. And I should be able to order shocks of equal dimensions to the Bilstein and end up near 50/50 up/down.
I'll cycle this one more time to confirm my measurements and after installing the new RJ trackbar in a couple weeks, hoping it clears the diff cover.

I might move on to the rear while the front is semi-assembled. I expect to find much the same results when the relocation bracket is removed and the rear springs are back in their stock bucket.

 

[jjvw]

Initial ride height of 4.5" RE front springs including ACOS
19"

Bilstein shocks
24.25" extended
14.25" full compression
10" shock?
7" shaft showing at ride height.
Doesn't that tell me I had 7" up, 3" down travel?/ Hardly 50/50

Removed ACOS and put the springs, shocks and tire/wheels back on. Trackbar disconnected at the axle, Anti-Rock disco also.
New ride height 17".
Driver 4.75" shaft exposed
Passenger 5" shaft exposed
Very close to 50/50 on 10" shock, correct?

My conclusion is that the Bilstein shocks are the correct length for 4.5" lift (RE springs) without the ACOS in place at 2" added. And I should be able to order shocks of equal dimensions to the Bilstein and end up near 50/50 up/down.
I'll cycle this one more time to confirm my measurements and after installing the new RJ trackbar in a couple weeks, hoping it clears the diff cover.

I might move on to the rear while the front is semi-assembled. I expect to find much the same results when the relocation bracket is removed and the rear springs are back in their stock bucket.

Track bar disconnected or just loosened?

Otherwise, your conclusions look good!

 

[notnsuv]

Track bar disconnected or just loosened?

Otherwise, your conclusions look good!

Disconnected at the axle and hanging. It looks like it should slide right in place if I need to.

 

[jjvw]

Disconnected at the axle and hanging. It looks like it should slide right in place if I need to.

It only needs to be loosened so that the bonded rubber bushing can rotate. This is true for any bonded rubber bushings there might be in the suspension. Disconnecting completely allows the axle to shift around in ways it never should while driving and will give weird results.

 

[notnsuv]

It only needs to be loosened so that the bonded rubber bushing can rotate. This is true for any bonded rubber bushings there might be in the suspension. Disconnecting completely allows the axle to shift around in ways it never should while driving and will give weird results.

Followed instructions from a how-to thread for pulling springs. I can put it back up and remeasure. Sure not moving the Jeep with it off. I'll be checking centering when it all comes together.

Now I'm pondering front shocks from the KYB chart.
565096 were recommended in a discussion on the forum but I'm not sure they're the best match for my measurements.
How precise does this need to be?

https://www.kyb.com/resources/technical-information/dimensions/

 

[jjvw]

Followed instructions from a how-to thread for pulling springs. I can put it back up and remeasure. Sure not moving the Jeep with it off. I'll be checking centering when it all comes together.

...

That "how to" thread is very wrong. The entire purpose of this exercise is to put the axle through it's normal range of movements. Removing links doesn't do that.

....
How precise does this need to be?
...

Close enough is good enough. You can't have perfect unless you start cutting and moving mounts.

 

[notnsuv]

That "how to" thread is very wrong. The entire purpose of this exercise is to put the axle through it's normal range of movements. Removing links doesn't do that.

I had it connected but loose for the entire cycling exercise and just pulled it off today to put the springs back in. Maybe I didn't need to do that.

Close enough is good enough. You can't have perfect unless you start cutting and moving mounts.

Good to know. 10" travel is what I'm after, right? I ain't cutting shit, I have enough trouble putting stuff back to OEM positions.

 

[notnsuv]

Front Shocks

KYB 565096 Bilstein 5100

Extended 25.31 24.25

Compressed 15.86 14.25

Travel 9.45 10.0

4.75 - 5" exposed shaft at ride height on the Bilstein. That would give me darn close to 50/50 travel.

Paralysis by analysis?

 

[Ovaltine]

Front Shocks

KYB 565096 Bilstein 5100

Extended 25.31 24.25

Compressed 15.86 14.25

Travel 9.45 10.0

4.75 - 5" exposed shaft at ride height on the Bilstein. That would give me darn close to 50/50 travel.

Paralysis by analysis?

It seems strange to me that you have 5” of lift and are sitting even travel with a 10” shock. You should be able to fit a longer shock based on my experience

 

[freedom_in_4low]

And to think, I once installed a lift on a TJ, out of the box, and the only thing I measured in the entire process was for where to drill a new hole in the front track bar bracket

 

[notnsuv]

It seems strange to me that you have 5” of lift and are sitting even travel with a 10” shock. You should be able to fit a longer shock based on my experience

Seems to be few options in KYB with correct mounts. 965096

S1

E3(51.6x82x0)

C0492

I'm wide open to guidance/suggestions. Lotta crap on a shock chart.

 

[notnsuv]

And to think, I once installed a lift on a TJ, out of the box, and the only thing I measured in the entire process was for where to drill a new hole in the front track bar bracket

Hopefully, with a reduced learning curve this will get me done with the rear a LOT quicker. Funny thing is, my trail buddies probably won't hear a thing I try to teach them about all this.

 

[freedom_in_4low]

It seems strange to me that you have 5” of lift and are sitting even travel with a 10” shock. You should be able to fit a longer shock based on my experience

The compressed length of the KYB is right in line with an 11" rancho, but with about 1-1/4" less on the extended side. I would (and did) go with the rancho but if he's wanting to use the KYB specifically I doubt he'll miss the downtravel.