3 or 4 Link vs standard control mount

[Ted]

Up here it is just a cool factor add on. Which leads to more having to have them because they are so cool. Then they show it to their friends and explain what they do and how cool they are. So it's a chain reaction of "I need them" because they are cool. They are not needed here for wheeling period.

 

[PStov98TJ]

Up here it is just a cool factor add on. Which leads to more having to have them because they are so cool. Then they show it to their friends and explain what they do and how cool they are. So it's a chain reaction of "I need them" because they are cool. They are not needed here for wheeling period.

I agree that they aren't needed for wheeling in most places. But one person's idea of a "good ride" is highly subjective. I could make a pretty good argument for setting one up even if you aren't climbing waterfalls or trying to keep up in JV. What it boils down to is, what do you want out of your rig on and offroad. Would I use a 3 or 4 link to the fullest extent? Probably only a handful of times. But could I use certain attributes of them on a daily basis, I think so.

 

[Ted]

I agree that they aren't needed for wheeling in most places. But one person's idea of a "good ride" is highly subjective. I could make a pretty good argument for setting one up even if you aren't climbing waterfalls or trying to keep up in JV. What it boils down to is, what do you want out of your rig on and offroad. Would I use a 3 or 4 link to the fullest extent? Probably only a handful of times. But could I use certain attributes of them on a daily basis, I think so.

I did say up here. 95% are new to jeeps and want them for the fact that their friend had it done. They go spend $40K on a new JK and have to have whatever they see that they think is cool not having a clue what it is even for.

 

[PStov98TJ]

I did say up here. 95% are new to jeeps and want them for the fact that their friend had it done. They go spend $40K on a new JK and have to have whatever they see that they think is cool not having a clue what it is even for.

I see what you're saying. I was just playing devil's advocate mostly. And I too have seen people do that. Crazy how much money and time people will spend on stuff that they don't even know why they'd need it or how to use it.

 

[Ted]

I see what you're saying. I was just playing devil's advocate mostly. And I too have seen people do that. Crazy how much money and time people will spend on stuff that they don't even know why they'd need it or how to use it.

I have a full 4 link setup in the closet with trusses. I may have the trusses installed but as far as the 4 link I have seen no reason yet to install it. Bought it from a guy needing cash. I have a bad habit of buying stuff when people need money. One day may do the 4 link if I ever figure out exactly I want.

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

i guess for me its more about the stuff ya cant see and the quality. Its kinda like a parachute, ya may not always need it or use it, but when ya do need it your are prepared for it 100%...

 

[Chris]

with all the information and education yall have given me has me wondering how a jeep even stays together. there are axles and drive links and control arms and track bars and currie joins and oem bushings and brackets and its all held together with one little bolt and nut.

Be thankful it's a Jeep. You're dealing with solid axles and a very, very simple engine in terms of design.

Get underneath a modern car like a new BMW and you'd have wayyyyyyy more crap to worry about. A TJ is about as simple as they come!

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

I hear ya for sure. Tinkering and thinking about it will drive you crazy. But honestly, I just figured this would be a good discussion to have on the forum. It definitely isn't something to do if you're trying to save money. And it may be above some of the users' technical ability, but installing a lift was once above my ability...until I read about it and tackled it myself.

Ive been told several times how a short arm lift can be equal to or out preform a long arm lift on a tj because of its short wheel base. Well if you go to a 4 link system wouldn't that be just an extension of a long arm kit in a way?
also I want to address the sway bar (front and rear) after we talk about the above question.

 

[PStov98TJ]

I'll answer your question with a question. How long is a "long arm"? Anything longer than stock? When you do a custom 4 link, you can make the arms how ever long you want. Usually, they end up longer than stock, but a lot of people end up with what they'd call a "mid arm" set up. But "short", "long", and "mid" are arbitrary terms. Short usually means stock length, mid and long mean longer than that. You are right about shorter control arms being just as good as "long arms" on a TJ though. They also get hung up on less stuff.

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

thanks for your response. The 4 links are pretty neat for sure.
My other question was, and it only seems practical when asking your rig to articulate in order to keep the body level as possible and the tires on the ground. So disconnecting the front and REAR sway bars before a trail ride seems the only fair thing to do , right?

 

[PStov98TJ]

Nope. On the surface, it sounds like a good idea. But you actually want BOTH attached whether you're on the road or on a trail. It keeps the body level and can keep you from flopping the rig in off camber situations. The only problem is that the front swaybar is pretty stiff for offroad use and it may limit articulation a little bit, which is still better than laying the jeep on its side. The rear sway bar actually has a proper amount of resistance. The best way to remedy this is a Currie Antirock which can be found on Amazon or @4LowParts for a better deal.

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

Well I don't like that answer very much ha
I figure from hearing people buying quick disc to make it faster to do, So the front end would articulate better was a great idea. Hmmm.

 

[PStov98TJ]

Don't like the antirock? Or the stock front swaybar?
I've got some quick discos from JKS on my Jeep. And honestly, I could've just coughed up a little more and had the Antirock, but I didn't know better at the time. I'm planning on saving up and getting one, and I'll sell my discos to someone who really wants them to offset the costs.

One thing you have to keep in mind is, just because the axle droops more, doesn't mean it's useful wheel travel. If you don't have enough spring pressure pushing the wheel down, you won't have any traction. The beauty of the antirock is that it's softer than the stock bar so it allows the wheels to travel up and down more freely, but in the same breath, it will keep your rig level while still allowing you to use realistic wheel travel. And it can be adjusted to be really soft, or almost as stiff as the stock swaybar. While it's really meant to set and forget, theoretically, you could set it on the tightest setting on road, and move it to the loosest setting before hitting the trail if you wanted to do that.

 

[Chris]

Where's @Jerry Bransford when you need him.

He's a guy who has run both long arm and short arm lifts, so in my opinion, he's one of the few who can actually give solid, un-biased, personal opinion.

I say that because there's guys such as myself who will tell you that a short arm lift is all you need, but I'm only saying that based off advice I've taken from knowledgable folks like Jerry, Blaine and others.

Not to say a long arm lift doesn't have it's purpose. However, if you watch videos of TJs on YouTube with long arm lifts, one thing you'll notice is how often they get winded up on rocks and other obstacles.

I think that maybe the ultimate solution (at least for a lot of people) might be a mid-arm lift like the ones @mrblaine builds. Of course everything is going to be use specific. It all depends on what you want to do with your Jeep.

DO NOT however buy into the notion that a long arm lift is better on-road. I can tell you with 110% certainty that a quality short arm lift (i.e. Currie) performs exceptionally on-road. My Currie 4" short arm lift rides like a fucking Cadillac going down the highway and over rough city roads, I kid you not.

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

Don't like the antirock? Or the stock front swaybar?
I've got some quick discos from JKS on my Jeep. And honestly, I could've just coughed up a little more and had the Antirock, but I didn't know better at the time. I'm planning on saving up and getting one, and I'll sell my discos to someone who really wants them to offset the costs.

One thing you have to keep in mind is, just because the axle droops more, doesn't mean it's useful wheel travel. If you don't have enough spring pressure pushing the wheel down, you won't have any traction. The beauty of the antirock is that it's softer than the stock bar so it allows the wheels to travel up and down more freely, but in the same breath, it will keep your rig level while still allowing you to use realistic wheel travel. And it can be adjusted to be really soft, or almost as stiff as the stock swaybar. While it's really meant to set and forget, theoretically, you could set it on the tightest setting on road, and move it to the loosest setting before hitting the trail if you wanted to do that.

ha I was just saying I dont like the answer that, you should not disconnect the sway bars when on the trails. I sure the antirock works well , but seems like disconnecting the sway bars would give you a lot more articulation and ( with good common since ) still keep you up right.

 

[PStov98TJ]

ha I was just saying I dont like the answer that, you should not disconnect the sway bars when on the trails. I sure the antirock works well , but seems like disconnecting the sway bars would give you a lot more articulation and ( with good common since ) still keep you up right.

It theoretically would give you more articulation...and with common sense you'd probably be fine and never have a problem. But for me, I can't account for every situation I could end up in and I like the insurance knowing my pucker factor will be much lower. But that's for my uses. Like I've said before, my buddy and I plan to wheel at places outside of Mississippi where off camber, rocky situations are much more likely.

One thing you have to keep in mind is, just because the axle droops more, doesn't mean it's useful wheel travel. If you don't have enough spring pressure pushing the wheel down, you won't have any traction.

And remember, more travel is not always what you want. You've gotta have enough spring for it.

 

[Chris]

but seems like disconnecting the sway bars would give you a lot more articulation and ( with good common since ) still keep you up right.

John Currie won King of the Hammers with his rig using a.... you guessed it... Antirock. Look at a lot of those pros and you'll see a lot of them aren't even running disconnects.

There can be no question whatsoever that an Antirock torsion bar is a better solution for probably 99% of us than disconnects.

So if that's true, why are so many people using disconnects? Simple... MARKETING HYPE!

They simply don't know any better, because they've been convinced by all these different companies that disconnects are what you want. Those people have obviously never used an Antirock, otherwise they'd see what it is they're missing.

 

[Eddie Greenlee]

Where's @Jerry Bransford when you need him.

He's a guy who has run both long arm and short arm lifts, so in my opinion, he's one of the few who can actually give solid, un-biased, personal opinion.

I say that because there's guys such as myself who will tell you that a short arm lift is all you need, but I'm only saying that based off advice I've taken from knowledgable folks like Jerry, Blaine and others.

Not to say a long arm lift doesn't have it's purpose. However, if you watch videos of TJs on YouTube with long arm lifts, one thing you'll notice is how often they get winded up on rocks and other obstacles.

I think that maybe the ultimate solution (at least for a lot of people) might be a mid-arm lift like the ones @mrblaine builds. Of course everything is going to be use specific. It all depends on what you want to do with your Jeep.

DO NOT however buy into the notion that a long arm lift is better on-road. I can tell you with 110% certainty that a quality short arm lift (i.e. Currie) performs exceptionally on-road. My Currie 4" short arm lift rides like a fucking Cadillac going down the highway and over rough city roads, I kid you not.

Well just being able to do some trails here and there with hills made of dirt and a few rocks and creeks (not like Moab) will be all i ever get to do im sure. We pretty much have to travel to our adjacent states to find trails. In Alabama i think its Hawk Pride and in Ark. its Hot Springs. I guess at this point in my life going through deep mud and tearing out every U joint and axle ya got is just not my cup of tea.

 

[Jerry Bransford]

I guess at this point in my life going through deep mud and tearing out every U joint and axle ya got is just not my cup of tea.

Ha neither is it mine.

 

[Chris]

I guess at this point in my life going through deep mud and tearing out every U joint and axle ya got is just not my cup of tea.

If you're at that point in your life (which I am as well!), then you'll appreciate that with an Antirock, you don't have to get out of the vehicle, disconnect your sway bar, then get back out again when you're done off-roading, and re-connect it (after it's muddy as hell).

With an Antirock, you don't have to get out of the vehicle at all! Haha