Wrangler TJ Radiator Replacement

Not_Invented_Here_ said:
Yeah I don't doubt you're right. I generally subscribe to the OEM is best point of view for most parts but my hot take is that people use their Jeeps in wildly different ways in many different conditions. There are more variables at work than brand name.

I don't remember if it was you who posted this, I think it was, but you or someone else explained how the difference between something like MOPAR sensors and aftermarket is the pre-sale quality testing and the acceptable failure range that determines what goes into the "for sale" bin vs. what gets tossed - basically how you can buy aftermarket and get a perfectly fine MOPAR-tier product but the chances of getting a shit product are way higher. I'm butchering the explanation but I remember going to talk with my dad about it (his work overlaps quite a bit with product development) after reading that and his response was "that guy knows exactly what he's talking about" ha.
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Yeah, you can find something similar on the YouTube How its Made episodes. They have one on oil pressure switches and the testing part shows them comparing the switch to the values they are supposed to be and then sorting them into bins for the ones that meet the spec, and then above and below.

The ones that meet the tolerance go to the OEM side, above and below but not too far go to the aftermarket. I think I still have a set of sensors I bought as spares for my 99. The CPS is exactly the same as the one I got from Mopar, same part number, made by Wells, etc. I would not bet that it is exactly the same as OEM.

The other thing that anyone looking at a radiator recommendation is to be keenly aware of is location of the recommender. If they are in an area like some places in the PNW, you can run around up there is a fully deficient cooling system and never know it. I've posted about that before. Gent from up there moved down here in July. Instant overheat condition to where he could only drive after dark with the heater on full blast.

Our cooling systems have to work as designed.
 
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Feralkid said:
You’re full of shit sir!🧐
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Hate to say this, but its the unvarnished truth. Now the darn thing could blow up tomorrow, but Behr radiators are well known for the longevity. I've changed the coolant religiously to Mercedes' specifications: Every 3 years in this case.
 
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Feralkid said:
The guy claiming plastic tanks lasted 35 years. I guess it’s possible. That engine must run cooler than the 4.0 is my guess.
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Its a diesel - they do tend to run cooler. Now it might blow tomorrow, but it sure wouldn't owe me anything. Unlike what I'm hearing about the Jeep radiator. The Behr radiators are known for getting brittle at the upper neck area when the proper coolant isn't maintained. I suspect - and hope! - that at least *some* of the trouble I'm reading about with Jeep radiators is from similar causes. I've had any number of 20 year old cars with zero radiator problems - I'm just flabberghasted that 10 years is considered normal and acceptable by this forum!

I of course have no idea of the history of the radiator that's in the Jeep, or its maintenance. When it lets go, I'll replace it - most likely with OEM unless I find something with a better history. BUT - if it blows again in 10 years after known proper mainentance, I'll replace it with a Behr, or something from a Toyota, or whatever with a better reputation - even if I have to re-bracket and re-plumb!
 
Feralkid said:
The guy claiming plastic tanks lasted 35 years. I guess it’s possible. That engine must run cooler than the 4.0 is my guess.
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I strongly suspect that if you were to take a 35 year old plastic tank radiator and run it in a TJ with the correct 18psi radiator cap at the 210 degree operating temp that it wouldn't last long. The temps and pressures modern engines run at to keep emissions low and efficiency high are not good for the cooling system bits.
 
Zorba said:
Its a diesel - they do tend to run cooler. Now it might blow tomorrow, but it sure wouldn't owe me anything. Unlike what I'm hearing about the Jeep radiator. The Behr radiators are known for getting brittle at the upper neck area when the proper coolant isn't maintained. I suspect - and hope! - that at least *some* of the trouble I'm reading about with Jeep radiators is from similar causes. I've had any number of 20 year old cars with zero radiator problems - I'm just flabberghasted that 10 years is considered normal and acceptable by this forum!

I of course have no idea of the history of the radiator that's in the Jeep, or its maintenance. When it lets go, I'll replace it - most likely with OEM unless I find something with a better history. BUT - if it blows again in 10 years after known proper mainentance, I'll replace it with a Behr, or something from a Toyota, or whatever with a better reputation - even if I have to re-bracket and re-plumb!
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It's likely that your 35-year old Mercedes has never been off-roaded , and thus it's Behr radiator likely doesn't suffer the same stress from torquing, twisting, and jarring that many TJ radiators must endure, all while being exposed to excessive heat in the engine bay. IMHO, 10 years is pretty good considering those conditions. Would I like it to be more? Absolutely. Do I expect it to be more? No.
 
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taylormade73 said:
It's likely that your 35-year old Mercedes has never been off-roaded , and thus it's Behr radiator likely doesn't suffer the same stress from torquing, twisting, and jarring that many TJ radiators must endure, all while being exposed to excessive heat in the engine bay. IMHO, 10 years is pretty good considering those conditions. Would I like it to be more? Absolutely. Do I expect it to be more? No.
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Take a look at how the flanges mount to the radiator some time. Once you see and understand that, you will quickly surmise that the core is not subject to any twisting forces whatsoever. If they were, those little nuts would snap right out of the little C channel cast into the plastic radiator tank.
 
mrblaine said:
Take a look at how the flanges mount to the radiator some time. Once you see and understand that, you will quickly surmise that the core is not subject to any twisting forces whatsoever. If they were, those little nuts would snap right out of the little C channel cast into the plastic radiator tank.
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I will check them out this weekend. If not that then, operating temp and under hood heat must be the major contributors.
 
taylormade73 said:
It's likely that your 35-year old Mercedes has never been off-roaded , and thus it's Behr radiator likely doesn't suffer the same stress from torquing, twisting, and jarring that many TJ radiators must endure, all while being exposed to excessive heat in the engine bay. IMHO, 10 years is pretty good considering those conditions. Would I like it to be more? Absolutely. Do I expect it to be more? No.
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That is the very FIRST comment on this subject that actually makes some damn sense! Thank you, I hadn't thought of that. That "suggests" that a metal radiator "should/could" be better, but apparently isn't by all accounts.
 
Zorba said:
That is the very FIRST comment on this subject that actually makes some damn sense! Thank you, I hadn't thought of that. That "suggests" that a metal radiator "should/could" be better, but apparently isn't by all accounts.
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The radiator is held in with tiny screws, it’s not transmitting load.

My recent radiator pop was on a 104 degree day while crawling, plus its 14 years old. I’d guess the heating and cooling cycles finally stressed it too much.
 
Apparition said:
The radiator is held in with tiny screws, it’s not transmitting load.

My recent radiator pop was on a 104 degree day while crawling, plus its 14 years old. I’d guess the heating and cooling cycles finally stressed it too much.
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That's good to know too - but this *does* beg the question: What about the radiators in Toyotas, Land Rovers, etc, etc? I'd bet even money that they usually last longer, but I don't know that... Vibration could account for part of the early failures as well.

How much of the 14 yo radiator's maintenance history do you know?
 
I personally feel that todays quality standards are way less than the years gone by. Just cheaper material, lack of true quality control. Most of all the days of parts makers being proud of their parts is gone. Just my 2 cents.
 
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Daron said:
I personally feel that todays quality standards are way less than the years gone by. Just cheaper material, lack of true quality control. Most of all the days of parts makers being proud of their parts is gone. Just my 2 cents.
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Agreed - but its worse than that. Things are designed to fail, parts are purposely unavailable, or they're part of an expensive "assembly", etc, etc, blah, blah, blah. I collect vintage sewing machines, some of them over 100 years old. 100 years from now, they'll still be operational if someone squirts some oil in their general direction every few years. New machines will be broken in 10 years, irreparable in 15, and junked in 20. The same goes for just about anything these days - "durable goods" aren't any more.

Warn winches seems to be a welcome exception to this.
 
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Daron said:
I personally feel that todays quality standards are way less than the years gone by. Just cheaper material, lack of true quality control. Most of all the days of parts makers being proud of their parts is gone. Just my 2 cents.
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If that were true, we'd see more bad Mopar radiators out of the box.
 
mrblaine said:
Fuck off with your statistic bullshit. I also believe we've discussed this before and you have another issue that is not radiator related if you went through 3 in short order.

That said, if you want to play the stupid fucking stats game, I've installed at least 30 OEM radiators in the TJ and TJ Unlimited. I have a 0% defect rate going back at least 10 years and 100's of 1000's of combined miles plus we live in a hot zone. I have a near 100% defect rate with aftermarket with a single exception being the Northern I mentioned above that I won't install because I think it is beyond stupid to have to pull the grill to install a radiator or work on the cooling system.
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To slightly high jack this thread you mentioned that with Northern you have to pull grill to install. Which I agree is a stupid design
My question is can you pull grill without removing A/c condenser and radiator it looks there is a cut out for AC lines to go through
I am thinking of removing grill to repaint A little fresh up from rock chips etc
 
Davidtj said:
To slightly high jack this thread you mentioned that with Northern you have to pull grill to install. Which I agree is a stupid design
My question is can you pull grill without removing A/c condenser and radiator it looks there is a cut out for AC lines to go through
I am thinking of removing grill to repaint A little fresh up from rock chips etc
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Yes, we do it all the time.
 
mrblaine said:
My buddy has an Autozone special in his YJ. It has been in there in use for at least 10 years. The only problem with that is we both know if I go to Autozone and try to get one just like it, my chances are almost zero for that happening.
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Good to know because I have a cheap radiator from Autozone and 6 years later it's still okay.
 
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